Need some advice choosing chainrings and cassette please.

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Ajax Bay

Guru
Location
East Devon
All good. Be aware that the FD cage is curved to fit your 53t current ring, with capacity to go to 56t (with 40 inner).
With the GRX 46t outer the shifting will be sub-optimal (am not saying 'it won't work') with greater risk of dropping your chain (both ways) so careful tweaking required to mitigate that risk.
 
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SafetyThird

Senior Member
Location
North Devon
Right, so after deciding all that, I had a reply from spa cycles to my enquiry comparing the GRX chainset with their sub compact chainset as follows.

"Our super compact chainset would be compatible with your bike with the recommended length bottom bracket. You would probably require a front derailleur dropper: https://spacycles.co.uk/m8b0s106p5161/SPA-CYCLES-Front-Mech-Braze-On-Dropper to accommodate the smaller chainring sizes. The advantage of our super compact over the Shimano GRX is that we can offer custom chainring sizes allowing for much lower gearing and it uses a standard 5 bolt BCD which makes sourcing replacement rings a lot easier. As your rear derailleur is a medium cage it is rated to 11-30 cassette however we have fitted 11-32 with the super compact chainsets and not encountered any issues."

So, my current setup would work as it is, apart from needing to add the dropper, and I'd have the option to go even lower on the gearing in future if required. The only downside I can see to it is I don't know if it's possible to add a power meter to those, I'm guessing probably not. However, it's by far the cheapest way to go subcompact for about £112 and I have the tools to install everything already.
 

si_c

Guru
Location
Wirral
Right, so after deciding all that, I had a reply from spa cycles to my enquiry comparing the GRX chainset with their sub compact chainset as follows.

"Our super compact chainset would be compatible with your bike with the recommended length bottom bracket. You would probably require a front derailleur dropper: https://spacycles.co.uk/m8b0s106p5161/SPA-CYCLES-Front-Mech-Braze-On-Dropper to accommodate the smaller chainring sizes. The advantage of our super compact over the Shimano GRX is that we can offer custom chainring sizes allowing for much lower gearing and it uses a standard 5 bolt BCD which makes sourcing replacement rings a lot easier. As your rear derailleur is a medium cage it is rated to 11-30 cassette however we have fitted 11-32 with the super compact chainsets and not encountered any issues."

So, my current setup would work as it is, apart from needing to add the dropper, and I'd have the option to go even lower on the gearing in future if required. The only downside I can see to it is I don't know if it's possible to add a power meter to those, I'm guessing probably not. However, it's by far the cheapest way to go subcompact for about £112 and I have the tools to install everything already.

Sounds like a great option. If you wanted to add a power meter later, then pedals are probably your only option, but prices have come down in recent years and while they are significantly more expensive than a crank arm option, it's not prohibitive. Plus you're saving on not needing to replace too much on the bike, so it will probably even out.
 

Ajax Bay

Guru
Location
East Devon
Right, so after deciding all that, I had a reply from spa cycles . . .
So, my current setup would work as it is, apart from needing to add the dropper, and I'd have the option to go even lower on the gearing in future if required. The only downside I can see to it is I don't know if it's possible to add a power meter to those, I'm guessing probably not. However, it's by far the cheapest way to go subcompact for about £112 and I have the tools to install everything already.
Got there! Glad Spa Cycles agree. See my posts above #25 and #34. Note you can choose a shorter crank too. The future-proofing of the inner ring (BCD 74mm) meets one of your aims. If you feel power measurement will add to you enjoyment out on the road (I suspect not, go for the HRM option), then a pedal based one is the way ahead.
Once done, you need to get up Lynmouth Hill: it's only a few 100 metres but it's one where you can clearly read the smallest font on your front hub, iykwim.
 
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SafetyThird

Senior Member
Location
North Devon
Ajax, yes it was your post that had me looking at that, it just took a couple of days to get a reply from Spa Cycles. I think that's now the way to go. I already have HRM, been using one for about 20 years, started with my running training and just carried over to cycling so yeah, no rush for power at the moment.

Now, the final piece of the puzzle are cassettes, I plan to get two so that I can put the same one on the trainer and hopefully not have any issues with indexing once it's set up. All the Shimano cassettes that go to 30 seem to start at 11, the 12's only go to 28. Miche do 13 and 14 to 30 which I'm considering. 13 maxes out at 25mph and 14 at 23mph. If I'm going that fast, it'll be downhill and I'm not likely to be pedalling, I can't ever see me holding 23mph on the flat. Wondering if there's any reason not to go for 14?

Edit, I'm currently on 170mm cranks so the only shorter option is 165. Having just had a full bike fit, I think I'll stick with 170's given everything else I'm changing.
 
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T4tomo

Legendary Member
Ajax, yes it was your post that had me looking at that, it just took a couple of days to get a reply from Spa Cycles. I think that's now the way to go. I already have HRM, been using one for about 20 years, started with my running training and just carried over to cycling so yeah, no rush for power at the moment.

Now, the final piece of the puzzle are cassettes, I plan to get two so that I can put the same one on the trainer and hopefully not have any issues with indexing once it's set up. All the Shimano cassettes that go to 30 seem to start at 11, the 12's only go to 28. Miche do 13 and 14 to 30 which I'm considering. 13 maxes out at 25mph and 14 at 23mph. If I'm going that fast, it'll be downhill and I'm not likely to be pedalling, I can't ever see me holding 23mph on the flat. Wondering if there's any reason not to go for 14?

Edit, I'm currently on 170mm cranks so the only shorter option is 165. Having just had a full bike fit, I think I'll stick with 170's given everything else I'm changing.

I've been using Miche cassettes for a while, I really like them. I use a 12-29 as I used to run a shimano 11-28. Worth checking with cycle clinic but I think he is now able to supply individual sprockets again (a while back Miche was making him order with 18 month lead-time on individual sprockets so he stopped doing them) as you only really wear the middle 3 or 4 most used ones out.

I'd err on caution and start at 13 maybe, it only one extra 2 tooth "jump"
 
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SafetyThird

Senior Member
Location
North Devon
Just thought I'd add a little update as I've now fitted the new bottom bracket, chainset, cassette and chain. All is working very well though due to the appalling weather here in Devon of late, it's only been on the turbo so far, planning to actually get out on it soon though. Thanks for all the helpful advice, I'm sure it'll make the summer riding much more enjoyable.
 

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SafetyThird

Senior Member
Location
North Devon
Okay, so a further update on this. Things didn't go according to plan.

On the turbo, where I'm not changing gear, everything seemed to be find but once out on the road, it really wasn't. Despite the Shimano guides suggesting everything should work, it just didn't. On the large cog at the back, it kept rubbing, the front shifter kept throwing the chain off on the inside and it wouldn't run properly on the big ring either. I spent quite a while watching park tools YouTube channel, tweaking everything I could but nothing would work.

So, I took it to a great bike shop we have locally and had a chat with them. They had it for a couple of days to try it out and see what they could do. Upshot was that none of it really worked together properly. He said he looked everything up in the book and agreed it should have worked but it just didn't. The new chainset just wouldn't work with that shifter and the rear, despite being within spec, wouldn't work either. Being 10 speed, nothing new really works with it so we were into changing derailleurs to try and get that working. The mechanic was pretty sure that he could find a suitable solution.

Couple of weeks go past and we have a mountain bike derailleur that works correctly with the pull of the 11 speed shifters and it runs the back nicely, with the advantage that I could go up to a 36 tooth if needed. The front needed the outer chainset guard removing and thinner chain ring bolts to attach them without it to try and bring the derailleur further out on the big ring. That still didn't work so a second hand derailleur up front did make a big difference to the shifting but it still wasn't quite right. They also put a narrower bottom bracket on to bring the chainline in a bit closer.

They then changed out the chainset for a Kranx 50/34 compact rather than subcompact and it worked perfectly. Changed it back to the subcompact and it wouldn't so we're now on a compact chainset. Also put a barrel adjuster inline on the front shifter cable as there wasn't one on the bike itself so it can be fine tuned more easily.

Everything is running very sweetly now but I have a sub compact chainset, bottom bracket and a couple of derailleurs in a box. Mind you, I also have an old 90's trek mountain bike sitting not doing very much so I'm looking at turning it into a gravel/bikepacking bike as a winter project.

Gearing wise, I'm currently at 101-30 with the 13-30 rear cassette. With the Miche cassette I can change individual rings but there are limitations with what can be at the top and the bottom. So I'm thinking that if I went to the 14 instead of the 13 my max pedalling speed would be 25mph which is plenty, I won't be pedalling faster than that but at the other end, the only rings Miche make larger than a 30 are 32 and 34, which would drop my gear inches to either 28 or 26 instead of 30. 26 is where I was on the subcompact chainset with the 30. So I'm tempted to go with the 24 but is that too big a jump from the 30? The cassette would end up being 14-15-17-19-21-23-25-27-30-34

As an aside, the mechanics had found the bike a fun project to work on as they'd never seen a bike like it, I think it's the only one in the country. They also said that even when parked next to bikes costing several thousand pounds, it attracted a lot of attention from the various cyclists who came in to the shop, which made me smile.
 

Alex321

Guru
Location
South Wales
Gearing wise, I'm currently at 101-30 with the 13-30 rear cassette. With the Miche cassette I can change individual rings but there are limitations with what can be at the top and the bottom. So I'm thinking that if I went to the 14 instead of the 13 my max pedalling speed would be 25mph which is plenty, I won't be pedalling faster than that but at the other end, the only rings Miche make larger than a 30 are 32 and 34, which would drop my gear inches to either 28 or 26 instead of 30. 26 is where I was on the subcompact chainset with the 30. So I'm tempted to go with the 24 but is that too big a jump from the 30? The cassette would end up being 14-15-17-19-21-23-25-27-30-34
I think most cassettes which go x-34 have the 2nd biggest being a 30. So it shouldn't be too big a jump.
 
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SafetyThird

Senior Member
Location
North Devon
Well sadly that change is not to be. The cycle clinic have told me that Miche don’t make 10 speed rings larger than 30 so if I want to go larger I’d have to find a ready built cassette from someone else or go back to sub compact at the front which we now know doesn’t want to work. Guess I’m just going to have to get stronger or buy a new bike. At least I’m better than where I was originally so that should help.
 

si_c

Guru
Location
Wirral
Well sadly that change is not to be. The cycle clinic have told me that Miche don’t make 10 speed rings larger than 30 so if I want to go larger I’d have to find a ready built cassette from someone else or go back to sub compact at the front which we now know doesn’t want to work. Guess I’m just going to have to get stronger or buy a new bike. At least I’m better than where I was originally so that should help.

What's wrong with going for something like a Shimano 11-34t cassette? I know you've got the 11/12t gears which you have said you don't need, but it gives you the bottom gear you are looking for.
 
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