'Missing' instructions - the modern way?

[PaulSB]

Yep, sign of the times. No one wants to spend time and money on paper when they can centralize the whole affair and produce a much poorer service

It isn't always a poorer service. I download and save manuals to my laptop. As an example the Garmin vivoactive HR manual is easier to read and view on screen than the paper version. I love being able to scroll a menu, click on the topic and get sent straight to the relevant section. I find this much easier than squinting my way through a small printed physical manual. There are many others I find very helpful.

However a bad app or manual is extremely frustrating and generally turns me away from the company. Examples I would give you, for various reasons, are Wattbike Hub, Shimano E-Tube and Wahoo Fitness. Another would be a sports communication app called Spond, most of you, I hope, will never have had the misfortune to encounter it, let alone use it!!

 

[Time Waster]

MTFU and stop using instructions!!!

 

[Fastpedaller]

Our new Bosch electric oven is rated at 13 Amps as is the accompanying induction hob. They don't have plug tops fitted to the cable as they are designed for fitted kitchens.

If they are wired into an oven/hob outlet behind the cooker it may be through a 45A supply and therefore not fused at 13A - The manufacturers should possibly be clearer on this? Any electrician's here to give guidance?

 

[SpokeyDokey]

You forgot to mention that the instruction book caters for forty different languages, thirty nine of which are entirely useless to the average reader.

Possibly forty for some people!

 

[presta]

Electrical circuit rating is based on the principle of diversity.

Think about your ring main - how many 13A sockets does it have? A dozen? Twenty? That's 156A or more in total, and yet it's fused at 30A. The reason is that you don't plug a 3kW heater into every socket on the ring. The loading on a ring main is specified by the floor area it serves because that's a better guide to the reality, people have lots of sockets so there's one conveniently nearby, not because they use them all to the maximum simultaneously, and most sockets carry light loads.

The same applies to cooker circuits. My cooker is 10.9kW in total (45.4A), but it runs off a 30A circuit, and the reason is that cooker diversity is calculated as the first 10A plus 30% of the remainder, plus an additional 5A if the cooker panel has a socket on it.

So my cooker needs a circuit rated at:
10+0.3*(45.4-10)+5 = 25.6A

 

[SpokeyDokey]

Ikea PAX wardrobe instructions; an absolute nightmare. Everything possible is done to reduce the whole instruction book to use of illustrations only ie no language.

Once you have worked out what goes where (can take a while on some sections of assembly) the kicker is that it is pretty damn hard to work out how much force to apply to some component parts during assembly.

Examples being the thin baseboard of drawers which snaps into place in an angled groove at 45° and an alarming amount if force is needed - you have to steel yourself up to this point bit by bit wondering if it is about to break.

Another being the right angled trim that holds all the mirror door panels in place. Looks easy in the instruction manual but, the trim first needs opening up by 90°, cue considerable force from fingertips being required, again expecting it to snap. Insert mirror panel and close the trim, again scary due to the force required and the alarming crunching noises that it makes whilst doing so.

Numerous other examples available.

Took a week of trial, and some error, to fully assemble 2 big units and securely bolt all 164kg to the wall.

If you watch YouTube you could be forgiven for thinking it only takes a couple of hours to completely assemble!

On the upside, it is rock solid and looks pretty damn good to boot.

 

[All uphill]

When I buy white goods I don't want to pay for a hard copy instruction manual.

It makes sense to me that information and instructions are on the Web, reducing the production, transport and environmental costs.

I appreciate that not everyone has access to the Web, but anyone who uses CC certainly does.

 

[SpokeyDokey]

Electrical circuit rating is based on the principle of diversity.

Crikey! PC and AC/DC, that could trigger a violent thread swerve.

 

[Fastpedaller]

Electrical circuit rating is based on the principle of diversity.

Think about your ring main - how many 13A sockets does it have? A dozen? Twenty? That's 156A or more in total, and yet it's fused at 30A. The reason is that you don't plug a 3kW heater into every socket on the ring. The loading on a ring main is specified by the floor area it serves because that's a better guide to the reality, people have lots of sockets so there's one conveniently nearby, not because they use them all to the maximum simultaneously, and most sockets carry light loads.

The same applies to cooker circuits. My cooker is 10.9kW in total (45.4A), but it runs off a 30A circuit, and the reason is that cooker diversity is calculated as the first 10A plus 30% of the remainder, plus an additional 5A if the cooker panel has a socket on it.

So my cooker needs a circuit rated at:
10+0.3*(45.4-10)+5 = 25.6A

All very true. Am I incorrect with my logic that if a 13A plug is removed from the feed wire to the cooker it should remain protected by a 13A fuse, and not connected directly to a 45A oven/hob outlet?

 

[Gwylan]

I've just realised that I really don't care about fuses and the funny regulation regarding plugs and cables on appliances.
Or what happens if you call it a medical appliance. Or even less about what the regulations are if you want to include a longer lead on an appliance.

I'm going for a bike ride..

Carry on

 

[presta]

Crikey! PC and AC/DC, that could trigger a violent thread swerve.

He was asking about cooker circuit rating, where's the thread swerve?

All very true. Am I incorrect with my logic that if a 13A plug is removed from the feed wire to the cooker it should remain protected by a 13A fuse, and not connected directly to a 45A oven/hob outlet?

Yes, it should really. On the one hand the oven flex won't be protected if you don't, but then, on the other hand fuses don't fully protect against appliance faults anyway....

 

[CXRAndy]

If they are wired into an oven/hob outlet behind the cooker it may be through a 45A supply and therefore not fused at 13A - The manufacturers should possibly be clearer on this? Any electrician's here to give guidance?

Not an electrician by trade, easy solution, change breaker for 16A B rated for cooker point. Keep older breaker incase you go back to 45A unit

 

[presta]

Not an electrician by trade, easy solution, change breaker for 16A B rated for cooker point. Keep older breaker incase you go back to 45A unit

Not if the hob's running off the same circuit.

 

[SpokeyDokey]

He was asking about cooker circuit rating, where's the thread swerve?

TIC: hence laughing smiley. Diversity (PC) and AC/DC could trigger a thread swerve (I did not say it had, btw). Seemed amusing to me.

I will put my serious head back on.

 

[fossyant]

It's not all bad, my new motor has the manual on line as a pdf. Far easier just clicking to the right part, or searching for how you use the bloody adaptive cruise control, and crash detection warnings etc, than flipping through a huge book that's used a few trees in it's production.

Lots of stuff comes with a quick start guide these days though.