Hybrid with torque sensor under £1500 or convert existing bike?

[ade towell]

Interesting so it doesn't feel the same as a direct drive torque sensor? Would that be the same for the other rear hub motors with torque sensors?

 

[Dadam]

I’ve never ridden a bike with a direct drive motor, if that's what you meant (usually the motors the size of a dinner plate that go over 30mph ridden by deliveroo riders). The smaller, legal hub motors tend to be geared i.e. have internal gears to maximise torque at the lower speeds.
I've also not ridden any hub motor ebike with a torque sensor, only mid drive bikes.

My Orbea Gain just has a cadence sensor on the cassette, but still manages to deliver a very natural feeling ride. The issue I had with the controller on the Woosh kit is summed up on this post I posted on another thread.

However, Woosh bikes do sell torque sensor based kits as well which would meet most of your criteria, although the weight is quite high, 3.3kg for the XF08 rear hub motor, 2.8 for the XF07 front hub motor, plus your battery of course.

 

[ade towell]

Yes it is the torque sensor kits from Whoosh I'm interested in though also good to hear the Orbea has a cadence sensor that can feel natural.

The direct drive DIY motors with torque sensor I am looking at can all be had in some kind of UK legal form I think?, they are ​

TSDZ2B - which seems to be an older well established motor that has had issues with heat and needs fiddling with the software to sort but is then quite reliable and pretty cheap. Apparently there is a larger newer TSDZ8 which handles heat better but has only just come out so reliability is unknown​

CYC Photon - which looks great and is smaller in size but is £1000 plus battery

ToSeven DM02/01 - very new but looks promising, the smaller DM02 is nearer the size of the Photon but much cheaper, can be had for about £300 although there are no UK suppliers yet so that would be sent from China and may well have customs duty on top and obviously no local support if things go wrong. It looks like the latest firmware has got that motor working very well though and is tempting although a bit of a risk

As you can see I've gone down a bit of a DIY rabbit hole, the allure of buying a kit is that my dad could still use his Whyte bike which he loves, and it can be moved from bike to bike and bits replaced if necessary - worry that many of these factory built are trickier to fix when out of warranty. Am happy to be wrong about that - in which case the Carrera and the Fiido are the 2 most appealing.
(Apologies for the weird formatting and bold bits, not sure what's happened there)

​

 

[CXRAndy]

There is also the cheaper TSDZ2B torque sensor motor although it seems to be less reliable and a lot more fiddling than the Photon - is that fair/true?

My wife's bike has a TSDZ2 motor kit fitted several years ago. It has been reliable, quiet and just the ticket to get her into regular summer riding.

 

[ade towell]

Did you have to play around with the firmware to reduce heat issues or has it been ok as is? Would only be after a boost to normal peddling, not expecting it to speed my dad up hills off road or anything too exciting

 

[MGman]

Yes it is the torque sensor kits from Whoosh I'm interested in though also good to hear the Orbea has a cadence sensor that can feel natural.

The direct drive DIY motors with torque sensor I am looking at can all be had in some kind of UK legal form I think?, they are ​

TSDZ2B - which seems to be an older well established motor that has had issues with heat and needs fiddling with the software to sort but is then quite reliable and pretty cheap. Apparently there is a larger newer TSDZ8 which handles heat better but has only just come out so reliability is unknown​

CYC Photon - which looks great and is smaller in size but is £1000 plus battery

ToSeven DM02/01 - very new but looks promising, the smaller DM02 is nearer the size of the Photon but much cheaper, can be had for about £300 although there are no UK suppliers yet so that would be sent from China and may well have customs duty on top and obviously no local support if things go wrong. It looks like the latest firmware has got that motor working very well though and is tempting although a bit of a risk

As you can see I've gone down a bit of a DIY rabbit hole, the allure of buying a kit is that my dad could still use his Whyte bike which he loves, and it can be moved from bike to bike and bits replaced if necessary - worry that many of these factory built are trickier to fix when out of warranty. Am happy to be wrong about that - in which case the Carrera and the Fiido are the 2 most appealing.
(Apologies for the weird formatting and bold bits, not sure what's happened there)

​

A bit late in posting this but:

Now at age of 82- here's just a little input.
I believe from reading the above I sense you are in danger of over-thinking this.

I enjoy riding my Ribble and Genesis bikes.I also have an Orbea Gain M20, and earlier for a few years owned a Raleigh Motus.
Bottom line - the non electic bikes serve a very different purpose to that of the Orbea.

When there are hills or a longer ride - then it's the Orbea. But for the joy of riding a relatively lightweight road bike - then it's the other two. Your Dad may well have a similar attachment to his Whyte bike.

Just get him a electric bike and let him choose which one the will want "on the day".

Oh and he's, lucky to have such a "caring" son. That means more than anything

 

[ade towell]

Thanks for your thoughts, and we had come to the same conclusion of keep the Whyte bike as is and add an electric. He's just waiting for his back to recover and then will try the Carrera Subway e bike mentioned earleir in the thread, Halfords do a 6 hour trial so will give him a good idea never having ridden an e bike before. Will go from there

 

[bonzobanana]

Thanks for your thoughts, and we had come to the same conclusion of keep the Whyte bike as is and add an electric. He's just waiting for his back to recover and then will try the Carrera Subway e bike mentioned earleir in the thread, Halfords do a 6 hour trial so will give him a good idea never having ridden an e bike before. Will go from there

Halfords do a range of ebikes that use the Suntour HESC system which are all torque sensor based. I personally think the Subway is probably the best option due to lack of suspension and being a strong multi-purpose ebike but they do 700c wheel based models like the Carrera Crossfire and a few hardtail mountain bikes like the Vengeance which is basically the Subway with a front suspension fork and a few other component changes. I'm not a fan of the Crossfire myself because of the Suntour NEX suspension fork but have seen on youtube a gig economy courier delivering takeaways across Bristol with one and clocked up huge miles and it seems to have given excellent service. There are quite a few steep hills in Bristol and he seems to go up them with minimal problems although the rider is quite light and seems to work 2-4 hrs on one charge which is probably 30 miles or more. Halfords at one point were taking 25p in every £ spent on cycling in the UK and because of their pricing and the fact they sell bikes at lower pricing meant it was estimated at one point they had 40% of bicycle sales. At the same time I think they claimed 11% of sales were ebikes. It's a staggering amount of ebikes with the Suntour HESC system that Halfords have sold.

 

[rualexander]

Whyte Rheo 2 on sale just now a at Cycles UK
https://www.cyclesuk.com/shop/bikes/sub/electric/whyte-rheo-2-139718/option/

Kynamic rear hub motor with bottom bracket torque sensor.
250wh battery and 45Nm torque.

https://whytebikes.com/products/rheo-2-my24-a

 

[404 Not Found Anywhere]

I would agree with MGman’s comments, I have an electric bike with mid drive and I fitted a motor to my recumbent trike. I don’t think it did anything to improve the trike, it turned it into a heavy lump and took the fun out of riding. Since I took the kit off I’ve been riding much more. I fear adding a e-bike kit to your dad‘s Whyte might have the same effect.

 

[TheDoctor]

I'm maybe a bit late here, but the Swytch Go kit is worth a look.
I've put 1000km on mine in a month.
No torque sensor option, but I very much like the feel of it.