Hybrid vs Road bike
- Thread starter mr_goosey
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I've come slowly through commuting on mtb, hybrid, good hybrid and now road bike, relaxed audaxey one anyway and the road bike is best
there's no doubt that it's quicker, in drops anyway, headwind is what used to really irritate me, drops make that far more bearable, roadie means you're liable to have thinner harder tyres and that's good for speed
I've still got full guard, a rack and a pannier and no end of lights
a road bike seems a bit advanced and scary at first but an hour's riding solves that and then you wonder how you'd ever been happy riding anything else
my opinion anyway, ride both types as others have set but don;t be put off by the road bike feeling twitchy and 'unsafe', your body just has to get used to it, I suspect a hybrid would feel like a tank to me now
there's no doubt that it's quicker, in drops anyway, headwind is what used to really irritate me, drops make that far more bearable, roadie means you're liable to have thinner harder tyres and that's good for speed
I've still got full guard, a rack and a pannier and no end of lights
a road bike seems a bit advanced and scary at first but an hour's riding solves that and then you wonder how you'd ever been happy riding anything else
my opinion anyway, ride both types as others have set but don;t be put off by the road bike feeling twitchy and 'unsafe', your body just has to get used to it, I suspect a hybrid would feel like a tank to me now
Randochap
Senior hunter
- Location
- British Columbia, Canada
A common myth
This is a common misconception -- one that I held until recently -- that has held sway for too long.
"Wider tires roll easier, yield higher mileage and offer more comfort and grip."
This is Continental tyre speaking, not me. They make this statement on their website for 2009. They do so because even the pro peloton is realizing the advantages.
The fact is that unless you are riding steel rollers (on which most rolling resistance tests are performed) a wider tyre with lower pressure will perform much better. In the real world -- that is, on uneven, poorly-maintained roads -- the wider, lower-pressure tyre rolls over irregularities, whereas the very high pressure tyre bounces around and actually slows progress, not to mention providing a very uncomfortable ride. The other factor is contact area. Wider tyres have a smaller contact area than narrower tyres, providing less resistance, yet, as I've mentioned above, absorbing and rolling over bumps. The advantage is particularly noticed on surfaces like dreaded chip-seal!
Of course, not all tyres are created equal and choice of construction -- casing, thread count, rubber and belt materials -- will maximise or interfere with base characteristics.
It may be hard to get one's head around these facts and some will refuse in the face of all evidence, but once you've tried it, there's no going back.
This bike is for me now my favourite all-round ride .. and I have all ends of the spectrum to choose from. I have even had a lightweight "event bike" built to accomodate tyres 28mm and above.
Schwalbe has also recently added to the widening knowledge that comfort and speed are not mutually exclusive.
As far as the OP's original question: go with practicality over bling factor. If you might consider touring later, get a touring bike now. Touring bikes are the all-rounder (and will fit bigger tyres). If you just plan to city commute, then the "hybrid" might be better ... but don't get one of the silly things that can't make its mind up whether it wants to race or navigate the potholed streets of the city. To my mind, those are mutually exclusive characteristics.
Tynan said:
This is a common misconception -- one that I held until recently -- that has held sway for too long.
"Wider tires roll easier, yield higher mileage and offer more comfort and grip."
This is Continental tyre speaking, not me. They make this statement on their website for 2009. They do so because even the pro peloton is realizing the advantages.
The fact is that unless you are riding steel rollers (on which most rolling resistance tests are performed) a wider tyre with lower pressure will perform much better. In the real world -- that is, on uneven, poorly-maintained roads -- the wider, lower-pressure tyre rolls over irregularities, whereas the very high pressure tyre bounces around and actually slows progress, not to mention providing a very uncomfortable ride. The other factor is contact area. Wider tyres have a smaller contact area than narrower tyres, providing less resistance, yet, as I've mentioned above, absorbing and rolling over bumps. The advantage is particularly noticed on surfaces like dreaded chip-seal!
Of course, not all tyres are created equal and choice of construction -- casing, thread count, rubber and belt materials -- will maximise or interfere with base characteristics.
It may be hard to get one's head around these facts and some will refuse in the face of all evidence, but once you've tried it, there's no going back.
This bike is for me now my favourite all-round ride .. and I have all ends of the spectrum to choose from. I have even had a lightweight "event bike" built to accomodate tyres 28mm and above.
Schwalbe has also recently added to the widening knowledge that comfort and speed are not mutually exclusive.
As far as the OP's original question: go with practicality over bling factor. If you might consider touring later, get a touring bike now. Touring bikes are the all-rounder (and will fit bigger tyres). If you just plan to city commute, then the "hybrid" might be better ... but don't get one of the silly things that can't make its mind up whether it wants to race or navigate the potholed streets of the city. To my mind, those are mutually exclusive characteristics.
Chris James
Über Member
- Location
- Huddersfield
Quoted from your Schwalbe link:
'Why do Pros ride narrow tires if wide tires roll better?
Wide tires only roll better at the same inflation pressure, but narrow tires can be inflated to higher pressures than wide tires. However, they then obviously give a less comfortable ride.
In addition to this, narrow tires have an advantage over wide ones at higher speeds, as they provide less air resistance.
Above all, a bicycle with narrow tires is much easier to accelerate because the rotating mass of the wheels is lower and the bicycle is much more agile.'
Basically it is a trade off, but I agree that fatter tyres give a plusher ride and can still roll well.
'Why do Pros ride narrow tires if wide tires roll better?
Wide tires only roll better at the same inflation pressure, but narrow tires can be inflated to higher pressures than wide tires. However, they then obviously give a less comfortable ride.
In addition to this, narrow tires have an advantage over wide ones at higher speeds, as they provide less air resistance.
Above all, a bicycle with narrow tires is much easier to accelerate because the rotating mass of the wheels is lower and the bicycle is much more agile.'
Basically it is a trade off, but I agree that fatter tyres give a plusher ride and can still roll well.
Randochap
Senior hunter
- Location
- British Columbia, Canada
Tynan said:
And you are comparing them to ...?
Randochap
Senior hunter
- Location
- British Columbia, Canada
Chris James said:
You cut the key conclussion: "In practice, the energy saving is even greater than in theory as the elasticity of the tires absorbs road shocks, which would otherwise be transferred to the rider and so saves energy."
All the other stuff only works if the road surface is good; when you're on anything but the smoothest ashphalt, all the "advantages" of a narrow, high-pressure tyre go out the window and the advantages of big -- I mean really big -- tires come into play. Given the already huge advantage of the smaller contact patch, the other virtues come to the forefront very quickly.
Let me give you a real world example: I love to turn up for our Wednesday group ride (as I did yesterday) on my 650b reproduction randonneuse. I run the Grand Bois "Hetre" (a Japanese copy of the typical French demi balloon tyre of the 1930s) which is a whopping 42mm! I run them at 60psi. The best evidence of their performance is on a long downhill on a very bumpy stretch of country road, paved with chip-seal. The group (about 15 yesterday) crests the hill and tucks. Because I'm the lightest of the group, at 130lbs, that's where I'm commonly left behind on my skinny-tyred (23mm) 700c bikes. Not on the Hetres. I have been known to pass the heaviest member of the group, who is well over 200lbs. Not only that, but my bike is silently gliding down the road, while everyone else is having their fillings rattled out.
I would have disputed these claims myself a couple of years ago, but they are verifiable facts, not theories, and in any case, we are advising someone who plans on becoming a commuter, not a racer trying to shave a second off a track record.
But don't take my word,(or Coninental's or, Schwalbe's or Bicycle Quarterly's) try it yourself -- with the proviso that all tyres are not created equal. A crap casing will ride harsh at any width.
Hi, I have had the Bad Boy 700 for six months, I do a seven mile each way commute most days, observations,
I changed the stem, sure the riding position looks great but it hurts the wrists and you end up bent over, had to get a shorter, angled stem even for my Large size one, common complaint.
As for looking cool, yes, but when fully spammed up with lights, mudguards, panniers etc it doesn't look quite as funky.
You dont need a disk specific rack, I bought one as that what the LBS told me I needed but a normal would be fine, fitted it anyway, however I had to make brackets to attach it to the downtubes out of old reflector brackets as it does not have the lugs.
It is a hard ride, no give in the frame whatsover as its very strong and stiff.
The pedals are crap, flogged them for £40 on Ebay and bought some SPD's
It is quite fast, I know that is dependant on the rider mainly but it does seem to convert more effort into forward motion than my old steel racer.
Brakes, I swapped my Hope Mono Mini's onto it from my MTB as to be honest the Avid Juicy threes aint that good, lever went almost to the bars and the bike shop said thats typical of them.
Drivertrain, Sram gears very good, reliable shifting but I am getting a click from the crank area, not sure if its the bottom bracket or pedals.
Wheels, quite strong but I seem to have buckled my back one on the bit off off road I do.
Seat, owww, ok now I have a Gel Cover.
I will treat it like I do a mobile phone, run it until my Cycle to Work scheme is finished and then go for a brand new one, £20 a month is nothing and the pull of a brand new bike will be too much, I think I will go for an Audax racer type next, something a bit comfier than the Bad Boy.
All in all its a good bike but its set up more for looks that day to day comfort, you will need to make changes to make it easier to live with if you use it everyday.
I changed the stem, sure the riding position looks great but it hurts the wrists and you end up bent over, had to get a shorter, angled stem even for my Large size one, common complaint.
As for looking cool, yes, but when fully spammed up with lights, mudguards, panniers etc it doesn't look quite as funky.
You dont need a disk specific rack, I bought one as that what the LBS told me I needed but a normal would be fine, fitted it anyway, however I had to make brackets to attach it to the downtubes out of old reflector brackets as it does not have the lugs.
It is a hard ride, no give in the frame whatsover as its very strong and stiff.
The pedals are crap, flogged them for £40 on Ebay and bought some SPD's
It is quite fast, I know that is dependant on the rider mainly but it does seem to convert more effort into forward motion than my old steel racer.
Brakes, I swapped my Hope Mono Mini's onto it from my MTB as to be honest the Avid Juicy threes aint that good, lever went almost to the bars and the bike shop said thats typical of them.
Drivertrain, Sram gears very good, reliable shifting but I am getting a click from the crank area, not sure if its the bottom bracket or pedals.
Wheels, quite strong but I seem to have buckled my back one on the bit off off road I do.
Seat, owww, ok now I have a Gel Cover.
I will treat it like I do a mobile phone, run it until my Cycle to Work scheme is finished and then go for a brand new one, £20 a month is nothing and the pull of a brand new bike will be too much, I think I will go for an Audax racer type next, something a bit comfier than the Bad Boy.
All in all its a good bike but its set up more for looks that day to day comfort, you will need to make changes to make it easier to live with if you use it everyday.
Hello, I got a hybrid on the cycle to work scheme in April, and although it is a good bike, I do wish I'd gone for something lighter and faster. In April I'll definitely be getting a new bike, and I think I'll go for a tourer - either a Ridgeback Panorama (http://www.evanscycles.com/products/ridgeback/panorama-2009-touring-bike-ec017049) or a Super Galaxy.
ed_o_brain
Guest
jimboalee said:If the Road bike and the Bad Boy are comparative weight, there is no reason you can't ride the Bad Boy as fast as a road bike.
Two bikes the same weight and similar riding position will be as fast as its engines can move it.
Sorry to disagree. The acceleration might be the same, but drop handle bars will mean you can get your back horizontal (not bum up in the air) and that makes things easier once you head up towards 20 mph.
But the main advantage of dropped handle bars for commuting, I find, is being able to get down out of a headwind or cross wind. If you intend to use the bike for any other longer rides, the drops will give more hand/body positions and will probably help with comfort.
You can go some way to that tho by adding bar ends. You might even want to consider butterfly handle bars.
And a note on tyres, wider tyres tend to be heavier than narrower ones. So that's more rotating mass. That's harder to get going and slows acceleration. It's not really possible to judge tyres just by size. They need considering as a whole package:
- width
- ride comfort
- grip
- puncture resistence
- life expectancy
What works best for you varies by bike, riding style, road conditions. It really is a very personal thing.
I've got a 90s rigid Cannondale MTB which I've just added slick tyres too. I'm adding a rack and mudguards. It's very light (for a commuter/hybrid), is not as overly attractive to thieves as your badboy will be, and has the virtue of not being like nearly every other commuter bike out there! (Matt black bikes seem to be really common lately!)
jack the lad
Well-Known Member
This is about getting the right tool to do a job. Style is very important in my book, but only if it doesn't compromise a function that I can't live without. For £700 you have a lot of choice, even at Evans. There is no one right answer, it's all a trade off and a question of finding the right compromise for you. All other things being equal go for the one that feels most 'right'.
The hybrid vs road bike question is a bit too simplistic. You can get virtually the same bike of any type with either drop bars (a road bike) or with flat bars (a hybrid). Either could be a minimalist lightweight job with no provision for racks, mudguards etc or a heavier duty fatter tyred tourer type with either 26 inch or 700c tyres.
For any particular type of bike the only real difference will be the riding position. Drop bars may more aerodynamic (but not much if you ride mostly on the tops), flat bars probably give you better vision, control and braking in traffic. You don't want a flat back riding position if you'll be carrying a rucksack. I get neck ache with drops and numb hands with flats, so can't win either way, you might suffer with neither.
A light 700c racer (flat or drop) might take less effort to pedal, but might be more prone to p*nctures and you'll get wetter when the road is damp. If you want to fit a rack and/or mudguards make sure there are fittings for them and include the cost in your B2W application. 26 inch wheels are more manoueveable for weaving round traffic and stronger. Disc brakes add weight but don't wear out rims and (good ones) give more control.
The best upgrade you could make for urban commuting is to fit a tough p*ncture resitant tyre like a Schwalbe Marathon Plus. Avoiding delays to fix flats will save you more critical time than making an extra 1/10th second between the lights. Tough tyres are relatively heavy (so no point in shaving grams from the bike weight) and not available in racer sizes anyway.
If I lived and commuted in a city I would get a Schwinn type American Cruiser style bike with no gears, just a rear coaster brake, swept back bullhorn bars, fat tyres, big chrome mudguards and a sofa to sit on. Slow down and take life easy...
The hybrid vs road bike question is a bit too simplistic. You can get virtually the same bike of any type with either drop bars (a road bike) or with flat bars (a hybrid). Either could be a minimalist lightweight job with no provision for racks, mudguards etc or a heavier duty fatter tyred tourer type with either 26 inch or 700c tyres.
For any particular type of bike the only real difference will be the riding position. Drop bars may more aerodynamic (but not much if you ride mostly on the tops), flat bars probably give you better vision, control and braking in traffic. You don't want a flat back riding position if you'll be carrying a rucksack. I get neck ache with drops and numb hands with flats, so can't win either way, you might suffer with neither.
A light 700c racer (flat or drop) might take less effort to pedal, but might be more prone to p*nctures and you'll get wetter when the road is damp. If you want to fit a rack and/or mudguards make sure there are fittings for them and include the cost in your B2W application. 26 inch wheels are more manoueveable for weaving round traffic and stronger. Disc brakes add weight but don't wear out rims and (good ones) give more control.
The best upgrade you could make for urban commuting is to fit a tough p*ncture resitant tyre like a Schwalbe Marathon Plus. Avoiding delays to fix flats will save you more critical time than making an extra 1/10th second between the lights. Tough tyres are relatively heavy (so no point in shaving grams from the bike weight) and not available in racer sizes anyway.
If I lived and commuted in a city I would get a Schwinn type American Cruiser style bike with no gears, just a rear coaster brake, swept back bullhorn bars, fat tyres, big chrome mudguards and a sofa to sit on. Slow down and take life easy...
Thanks for all your advice, much appreciated!. I will have to visit Evans and test ride a few. Shame that you think the bad boy has some problems, I had kind of settled on that. I was looking through the road bikes that Evans have <£700 and didn't like the look of any of them (apart from some of the fixed gear ones, and I'm not sure I can handle that!)
Bugner
New Member
- Location
- Sarf London
I had the same dilemma when getting a bike via the scheme for 12 mile each way commute. Ended up buying the Specialized Tricross (Cyclocross Bike) Bit more robust than a road bike miles lighter than a mountain bike. It also has what is sometimes known as 'sissy brake levers' on the main hadlebar as well as the standard drop handlebar brakes if it takes you a while to get used to the drops, but to be honest a lot of the time I have my hands on the hoods anyway. I love it!! Great bike!!
Funtboy
Well-Known Member
- Location
- London via Jarrow
mr_goosey said:
Get this one. It's lush....
http://www.evanscycles.com/products/gary-fisher/mendora-2009-hybrid-bike-ec017198
