HGV Posters In London

[Jezston]

I was in London visiting family this weekend, and saw this poster an awful lot:

I have to say, if HGVs really can't see that much around them, what the f*** are we doing letting them drive around our inner cities?

Why the hell are TFL deciding how dangerous these vehicles are, and instead of either demaning they do something about the amount of blind spots around their vehicles, or just keeping these things out of built up urban areas, they put a load of posters up telling cyclists to be careful around them, thus passing on the responsibility to the potential victims?

It's like putting posters up aimed at young women saying "don't wear that little skirt, there are loads of rapists about" or something.

FFS.

 

[Simba]

While I do agree with you about HGV's on urban roads, they are unfortunately a necessary evil to everyday life. My heart is always in my mouth when I see a cyclist undertaking anything on four wheels, let alone something as big as a bus or HGV.

 

[fossyant]

Don't see a problem with it (the poster).......... there are plenty of stupid cyclists that go up the inside of trucks/busses - some really simple messages need to be put over - this is fairly easy to understand.

Driving/cycling - you need to be aware of both your vehicle's blind spot and those of other vehicles....

 

[Fab Foodie]

Jezton
Don't be a knob!
Road safety is the responsibility of ALL road users.
Unfortunately many cyclists are simply unaware of the dangers of going-up the inside of vehicles at junctions particularly busses and trucks. In fact many so called 'cycle-lanes' even encourage this manoever to get to the head of the queue.

A truck is a difficult thing to drive and manoever in a city and a bike is a small swift moving object in comparison that can appear inside a truck and then under it or crushed against barrierswithin seconds without even the best truck driver noticing. If cyclists don't ride-up the inside of trucks particularly at left turns, they're not likely to get flattened.

At least TFL and this poster are trying to improve the situation and educate both cyclist and truck driver.

Mosts cyclists fatalities in London are due to trucks. A little education all-round is a good thing.

 

[Davidc]

I agree that there should be action over having these monsters on urban roads, and that action should be taken over blindspots.

BUT

I don't find any problem at all with the advert. It is providing basic information. There's no question of "thus passing on the responsibility to the potential victims", we all have to take our part of the responsibility for our own well being, and this is helping to provide the information needed for cyclists to do just that. TfL is the advertiser, and as such is taking a small part of its responsibility for road safety.

Even if we did away with motor vehicles and all goods traffic on the roads were horse or human drawn there would still be a need for cyclists to understand how to avoid being killed or injured by carts and drays. (They were, and did need educating).

You and I may already know about the risks from LGVs, both being people who read about cycling related issues. Many of those seeing these adverts will be cyclists who don't understand the risks. If just one person sees that ad and as a result doesn't undertake a lorry then it's a good thing.

Edit: While I was writing this FF posted - I have to say I agree with hin, including his first line.

 

[jimboalee]

Good poster.

There's a second valuable lesson to be learned.

Squint, and the riders in PURPLE disappear.


Jimbo's Second rule of cycling.

2/ Wear bright clothing and display lamps at night.

 

[As Easy As Riding A Bike]

TfL say - "All of these bikes are in the driver's blind spot."

So let's encourage them to get in that position!

Nice work TfL.

(From here).

 

[Origamist]

Thankfully all post 2000 reg HGVs will not have such a poor mirror array and the driver will be able to see more. I'm also not convinced the nearside mirrors are correctly adjusted/set-up in the TFL mock-up.

As I've said many times before, the problem of cyclists in front of the HGV is not being addressed and this is a major flaw in the campaign, IMO.

There also needs to be more educational work done with HGV dirvers and we need to get more contractors to sign up to the FORS scheme (at the very least).

 

[zimzum42]

Another call to ban HGVs from city roads - great, so we'll have hundreds of vans tearing around instead, more traffic, and more fumes.

The poster is good, and there are hundreds of muppets out there on bikes who should take heed of it...

 

[DrSquirrel]

Cost.

Get HGVs off the road (time, size, location), cost of anything they transport will go up.

They already complain about fuel prices going up (considering they pass on the cost to us).


And... I doubt anyone goes riding around in a HGV for shoots and giggles.

I would focus on the single seat occupancy issue with cars, and 1 mile trips to get a paper etc first.

 

[Jezston]

Ok, I do understand the issue of muppets undertaking lorries and buses, but the thing that really shocked me about that poster is how HUGE a lorry drivers blind spot is presented as being.

Is it really the case that three meters out from the entire length of a lorry is invisible to the driver?

If that really is the case, shouldn't something be done about that?

 

[zimzum42]

They are doing stuff about it - more driver training, laws that force new trucks to have more mirrors.

But there will always be blind spots, and some of them can be quite big, even with all the extra mirrors, so cyclists need to be educated too

Better they think the whole of the inside is the danger zone than they think it's ever OK to sneak up the inside

 

[clarion]

If cyclists don't ride-up the inside of trucks particularly at left turns, they're not likely to get flattened.

I'm afraid tht's untrue, and I'd be very surprised if you haven't either come close to being left-hooked by a truck steaming past you and turning across, or had one pull into your lane without checking.

The cyclist deaths in London are mainly of people who had trucks pull up alongside them, who forgot about the cyclist who had formerly been in front.

It's about six weeks since I was in court giving evidence in the case of a young man who, almost two years ago, had a truck drive over his pelvis in a left hook. Although he is riding again, he can't yet get back to commuting. The driver got five points on his licence so he didn't quite lose it, what with the speeding conviction and the one for using a mobile phone since he ran over one of us!

On Friday, I gave a man my details for a case where an artic pulled into his lane and came close to knocking him and the baby in the child seat to the ground. I have, of course, complained to the company, and reported it to the Roadsafe website.

But I see so much cyclist education on this issue, and almost bugger all done with drivers. It's disproportionate.

 

[snailracer]

Ok, I do understand the issue of muppets undertaking lorries and buses, but the thing that really shocked me about that poster is how HUGE a lorry drivers blind spot is presented as being.

Is it really the case that three meters out from the entire length of a lorry is invisible to the driver?

If that really is the case, shouldn't something be done about that?

Unfortunately, yes. As soon as the cab turns, all the mirrors are directed uselessly at the side of the trailer.

There are some experimental lorries with arrays of ultrasonic "reversing sensors" mounted along the side of them. They are cheap and IMO should be made mandatory-fit.

 

[CopperBrompton]

Jezton, you're missing the fact that the cab has turned - at that stage, all the nearside mirrors will be showing is the side of the trailer.

It's a good poster, and I'm pleased to see that TfL is doing a lot of education on this topic. They were sticking cards on parked bikes the other day.