Helmets; The Paramedics View

[Learnincurve]

This is my opinion. People on the internet seem to like to throw around theory and figures a lot but there is a tendency to reject what experts have learned all on their own or seen with their own eyes, until they write it down in a handy chart or academic paper and then it becomes "evidence" in arguments

 

[Drago]

I'm not really worried about anything he might say on the topic of helmets unless he can evidence his view.

 

[Learnincurve]

OK before it degenerates with people reading too much into what I wrote down. Which was him explaining his opinion to me like I'm 5. He may very well have the evidence for the case for wearing helmets at high speed and whatnot, but you can't link stuff via someone else over the phone.

I will speak to him tomorrow in real life and take notes this time. That's if he wants to talk about it, he may not, not because he's cross with anyone, he's a sweary man anyway, but because he was very clear that he just won't care if you were wearing one or not when he arrives on scene and would treat you just the same, also that he can't stand it when people try to make this sort of thing mandatory because we should all have freedom of choice.

 

[Fab Foodie]

OK before it degenerates with people reading too much into what I wrote down. Which was him explaining his opinion to me like I'm 5. He may very well have the evidence for the case for wearing helmets at high speed and whatnot, but you can't link stuff via someone else over the phone.

I will speak to him tomorrow in real life and take notes this time. That's if he wants to talk about it, he may not, not because he's cross with anyone, he's a sweary man anyway, but because he was very clear that he just won't care if you were wearing one or not when he arrives on scene and would treat you just the same, also that he can't stand it when people try to make this sort of thing mandatory because we should all have freedom of choice.

 

[jefmcg]

I'm sure I am TMN @User here, and certainly @Fab Foodie, but helmets are designed for falls from a stationary bike. Once you are moving at 25mph and crash, you definitely need a helmet, but a standard bicycle is no good at all. A motor cycle helmet may save you life.

(I was riding with some friends to Brighton, and one of them pulled away from me on Reigate hill. I wished I was wearing a helmet and could stop riding the brakes. However, I then realised that here 46km/h and my 37km/h - thanks strava! - would be much the same damage if either of us were wearing a helmet or not)

 

[GrasB]

OK before it degenerates with people reading too much into what I wrote down. Which was him explaining his opinion to me like I'm 5. He may very well have the evidence for the case for wearing helmets at high speed and whatnot, but you can't link stuff via someone else over the phone.

I will speak to him tomorrow in real life and take notes this time. That's if he wants to talk about it, he may not, not because he's cross with anyone, he's a sweary man anyway, but because he was very clear that he just won't care if you were wearing one or not when he arrives on scene and would treat you just the same, also that he can't stand it when people try to make this sort of thing mandatory because we should all have freedom of choice.

So I should listen to someone who almost certainly doesn't have the qualifications & training to make a real judgement call on how effective a helmet was because they've seen things first hand, but rather is trained to a very high standard in treating a myriad of injuries on a first-line basis.

Hint - there is a reason why the department which researches injury prevention is staffed almost exclusively by physicists and engineers rather than medical staff.

 

[deptfordmarmoset]

Much as I sympathise with your claim, it cannot stand. There simply are no TMNs awarded in helmet threads because everything has been said umpteen times umpteen already.

I know what you mean but you're a real meanie.

 

[Learnincurve]

So I should listen to someone who almost certainly doesn't have the qualifications & training to make a real judgement call on how effective a helmet was because they've seen things first hand, but rather is trained to a very high standard in treating a myriad of injuries on a first-line basis.

Hint - there is a reason why the department which researches injury prevention is staffed almost exclusively by physicists and engineers rather than medical staff.

When I said he may have evidence, I mean he may well have accumulated actual papers/links on the subject of crashing at high speed, they may very well have been written by engineers, I will have no clue till tomorrow. Unsurprisingly someone who's job it is to deal with head injuries takes a great deal of interest in the "why did that happen" aspect of the job.

No one has mentioned the chain guard thing though. He thinks people should fit chain guards,

 

[Profpointy]

When I said he may have evidence, I mean he may well have accumulated actual papers/links on the subject of crashing at high speed, they may very well have been written by engineers, I will have no clue till tomorrow. Unsurprisingly someone who's job it is to deal with head injuries takes a great deal of interest in the "why did that happen" aspect of the job.

No one has mentioned the chain guard thing though. He thinks people should fit chain guards,

the chain guard thing is a bit odd. Maybe he's on a mission to save people from getting oil on their trousers

 

[Learnincurve]

Oh and btw I have absolutely no idea who is pissed off with what aspect of what he said.

Is it that he does not think that casual riders should wear them if they don't want to and that it's the car hitting you at 60 that will hurt you, helmet or no helmet? Or is it that he thinks that people in a situation where they are travelling in a pack at high speed, like in a peloton should wear helmets but that if you want to ride on the road at 30 mph without one then that's fine by him because it's one less heart attack he has to attend?

He really isn't going around going "rawr, I am medical professional man! Listen to me you must wear a helmet!!!" I don't wear a helmet, even on the road and it never came up until I brought it up today he gives that little of a monkeys about the subject.

 

[Learnincurve]

the chain guard thing is a bit odd. Maybe he's on a mission to save people from getting oil on their trousers

Naw, he's worried about them snapping in a accident, paramedics tend to look at things like "what would happen if they were hit by a HGV?". I have a picture of that terminator vision thing but with more danger points and extraction methods.

 

[glasgowcyclist]

Naw, he's worried about them snapping in a accident, paramedics tend to look at things like "what would happen if they were hit by a HGV?". I have a picture of that terminator vision thing but with more danger points and extraction methods.

I don't understand this. What difference does anyone expect a chain guard to make in a collision with an HGV?


GC

 

[Fab Foodie]

I don't understand this. What difference does anyone expect a chain guard to make in a collision with an HGV?


GC

Scrap value?

I guess a chain guard could prevent outer chain-rings cutting into somebody's leg maybe .... but this is not a problem for a real cyclist because they only ride the big ring ....

 

[mcshroom]

I don't understand this. What difference does anyone expect a chain guard to make in a collision with an HGV?


GC

Less oil in one's leg wounds?

 

[Profpointy]

Naw, he's worried about them snapping in a accident, paramedics tend to look at things like "what would happen if they were hit by a HGV?". I have a picture of that terminator vision thing but with more danger points and extraction methods.

surely he isn't envisaging some kind of "Babs" on Pendine sands decapitation is he? Might be worth explain that the chain drive on a land speed record car is a bit more of a worry than a push bike - and I have snapped a bike chain - and biggest risk was a very long push home