Helmets stop people cycling

[Joey7415963]

The manual makes it clear that it is aimed primarily at motorcycle helmets. The introduction makes it clear that it is not an authoritative text, it is not an academic document, that it reflect the biases of those unvolved in its creation and that it has not involved a rigorous review of the available evidence.

You asked for proof that WHO supported helmet wearing, that's what the link was there for, not to aid evidence.

Now you said the WHO don't support helmet wearing, where's your proof.

P.S. Apologies for coming across aggressive before hand.

Still waiting for that proof...

You can keep editing your posts but you have still failed to back up your claim with evidence (which you told me off for and said I was "spouting bollocks").

 

[StuartG]

The manual makes it clear that it is aimed primarily at motorcycle helmets. The introduction makes it clear that it is not an authoritative text, it is not an academic document, that it reflect the biases of those unvolved in its creation and that it has not involved a rigorous review of the available evidence.

No. Don't try and switch the argument.

You called trying to balance the most optimistic helmet claims against the disbenefit of discouraging cycling bollocks. Why?

 

[numbnuts]

Oh dear one of those threads again

 

[StuartG]

Yep - I'm ducking out. I have to go to Brum on the train. Should I wear a helmet - or would other passengers find this discouraging. Discuss ...

 

[snorri]

That is a good point to end on.

Don't leave before we get round to discussing the claims re helmet wearing and relationship with neck and spinal injuries.

 

[StuartG]

Nice people go to Moor Street ... On bicycle and wifi friendly trains ... Peace!

 

[ufkacbln]

"Finally your argument: pedestrians don't wear helmets so why should we, is floored since you fail to grasp the concept that road users are more likely to meet cars than pedestrians (I don't feel that statement needs citation), also, pedestrians falling over are likely to experience less force than bicyclists traveling at 30/40km/h.

That is a very worrying post!

You are now adding conditions to your "formula" to avoid answering a very simple question as tpo whether your ORIGINAL FORMULA could apply to pedestrians.

Secondly you seem unaware that the oposite of what you claim is the fact that cycle helmets are only designed to act in impacts of 12 mph or less - making them mores uitable for pedestrians than cyclists!

Finally - please do look at the BMA and read what they have to say. Pedestrian head injuries from simple falls provide 43% of all head injuries and cyclists less than 5%

 

[hopless500]

I wear a helmet on a motor bike. I buckle up in a car. That's because I believe both make substantive difference in an impact and are worth the trouble. They are heavy enough duty to do so and protect the parts most at risk in a collision.

I wear gloves when cycling for the same reason. I do not wear a helmet because its a relatively minor risk and the protection offered is minimal.

Ditto
Edit/ Should add that it's also because, according to the reports I've read, a helmet can cause additional rotational brain injuries, which would not have occurred without a helmet.

 

[StuartG]

I've read, a helmet can cause additional rotational brain injuries, which would not have occurred without a helmet.

Is this conjecture or fact? Is there reliable field evidence?
One must be as hard in challenging claims that support our practice as those that oppose it.

 

[Joey7415963]

That is a very worrying post!

You are now adding conditions to your "formula" to avoid answering a very simple question as tpo whether your ORIGINAL FORMULA could apply to pedestrians.

Secondly you seem unaware that the oposite of what you claim is the fact that cycle helmets are only designed to act in impacts of 12 mph or less - making them mores uitable for pedestrians than cyclists!

Finally - please do look at the BMA and read what they have to say. Pedestrian head injuries from simple falls provide 43% of all head injuries and cyclists less than 5%

The formula has no conditions, it is a universal formula, meaning if an object has a mass, and a velocity the force will be determined by the impact time.

It's a formula that's been around for years with plenty of proof to its application.

I'm sorry you're so worried about this.

 

[ufkacbln]

The formula has no conditions, it is a universal formula, meaning if an object has a mass, and a velocity the force will be determined by the impact time.

It's a formula that's been around for years with plenty of proof to its application.

I'm sorry you're so worried about this.

Please read my post

In the meanwhile does your original formula work for a pedestrian or not?

 

[StuartG]

The formula has no conditions, it is a universal formula, meaning if an object has a mass, and a velocity the force will be determined by the impact time.

If the impact is greater than 12mph and the shell is breached and the foam is free to move from the point of impact then there is little or nothing to absorb/slow the impact. In other words no one is doubting the formula per se - only that it will result in forecasting a similar bang to the head whether a helmet was being worn or not at moderate to high impacts.

I've seen shells breached in 5mph impacts.

 

[ufkacbln]

I

Force = change in momentum / time

Increasing time of impact (cushioning the blow), reduces the force.

Lets make this as simple as we can....

Does this formula apply to pedestrians or not.

If a pedestrian fell over would a helmet reduce the impact or not?

But if you agree they aid in some collisions why wouldn't you wear one?

Why should a pedestrian not apply your theory?

 

[Schmilliemoo]

Interesting debate chaps. I'm a motorcyclist about to start cycling. I'm used to dressing like robocop when I get on my moto and have heard this before that cycle helmets are worse than useless - is there any protective gear I SHOULD be considering, either with or without helmets? Seems weird not to.

 

[ianrauk]

Interesting debate chaps. I'm a motorcyclist about to start cycling. I'm used to dressing like robocop when I get on my moto and have heard this before that cycle helmets are worse than useless - is there any protective gear I SHOULD be considering, either with or without helmets? Seems weird not to.

Gloves for hands...that's all.