E-bikes and fitness

[gzoom]

I've now got two eBikes, the Creo is a totally different beast to the Boardman, am 41, no health probelms, zero chance I'll be another analogue bike ever again. Next on the list to acquire is a hardtail machine.

For actual fitness I use the stationery bike where you can follow a specific program of pre determined effort levels much easier.

 

[mustang1]

The vast majority of times I continue riding my leg power bike. But riding my e bike is huge fun too and I usually ride that when I do not feel like exerting much power yet still want to get out for fresh air.

When I first got it, I rode around in power level 1 (lowest) of 4 but now I ride on levels 2 or 3 most of the time; I figure I either want reasonable assistance or I would have just ridden my normal bike.

It's definitely huge fun and I think the mid drive motors are better if you want to mimic the natural feel of human power but hub drive motors have other advantages in that they have less drivetrain wear.

I didn't get an e bike for the fitness aspect but to just continue going out when I can't be bothered. I guess if that gives a small fitness increase then so be it, but I don't think it gives much fitness benefit the way I ride it these days.

The ring I dislike most about my e bike is that it's quite big and cumbersome to manoeuvre when walking it about. Once your on the bike then it is no problem and it's really rather comfortable. Ironically for longer journeys, I much prefer a normal road bike: it's faster. But then again, I'm comparing it to an e-mtb; perhaps an e-gravel bike, being lighter than my e-mtb, will see more benefits on road.

 

[Slick]

Very interesting replies so far, giving me plenty of food for thought. I haven't even thought as yet about what are available and which models are in my price range. That will come later.

One idea that has struck me is that I might try to hire one for a few days so I can learn more about them in practice so will search around locally for a hire shop.

The guy round here would give you one for a couple of days if he thought there was a sale at the end of it. He took both Mrs Slick out on a trial run and took us up every hill He could find. We then took them out for the day which convinced Mrs Slick that was for her.

 

[BoldonLad]

Very interesting replies so far, giving me plenty of food for thought. I haven't even thought as yet about what are available and which models are in my price range. That will come later.

One idea that has struck me is that I might try to hire one for a few days so I can learn more about them in practice so will search around locally for a hire shop.

We found that most places were willing to offer an extended “test ride”, for a small fee, which was discounted off sales price, if you bought one. Only problem we found with that was, some models had poor availability. That may have improved now.

 

[Mike_P]

Please excuse my silly questions as a non e-bike rider, but does this mean that you get assistance to help you keep at or below 15.5mph, even on gradients, but the second you exceed that it switches off and you are suddenly relying 100% on leg power to get a 16kg bike to cruise at 16mph or beyond?

The assistance on a legal ebike will only kick in upto 15.5mph; whether it does is down to the rider switching the assist on and at what level. My ebike has five levels of assist, as it's outings are typically hilly it's a matter of judging how much assist and when to apply it to ensure there is adequate battery power left to get back home typically laden down by a full rucksack and/or panniers from a shopping trip. I find it rare to actually reach 15.5 as a constant figure due to the almost constant undulating terrain. Up grade normally it's a lower speed and downgrade the speed typically exceeds 15.5 and the assist if it was on turns off. On a very steep hill that I would not think about tackling on a non ebike flat out pedalling with the motor on full assist is lucky to reach double figures so it's never a case of sailing along at 15.5 whatever the terrain IME

 

[fossyant]

If you've health issues that are stopping you riding, go get one - you've said it's restricting where you can ride. Go for it.

Bit pointless for someone young fit and healthy though !

We've an older chap that comes out with the local MTB group. Depending upon the 'climbing' he'll either come out on his e-bike or normal MTB. Just enables him to keep up on the climbs.

 

[biking_fox]

OtherHalf has health issues and solely riders an ebike. Wouldn't ever go back, means we can go out on joint rides. The acceleration of an ebike can give (motor weight etc variable) gives me a proper work out keeping up pulling away from the lights. We also have an e-tandem to ride together. It's a lot of fun feeling the motor kick in, (and you really notice when it kicks out at 15.5mph which tends to be our max speed). But I (healthy) wouldn't swap my existing bikes to e, The weight is noticeable and as a predominantly road commuting cyclist I spend a lot time above 16mph.

 

[Smokin Joe]

Bit pointless for someone young fit and healthy though !

You must remember that most people who ride a bike do not do so for fitness or pleasure, but as a cheap and convenient way to get round. The fitness aspect to them is merely a by product, and if they are tempted by an e-bike they will ride for longer distances and more often, thus upping their fitness level. Hills are not a challenge to such people, they are a pain in the butt to be endured.

 

[HobbesOnTour]

Not an E-bike owner and not someone who pays attention to performance so dismiss as appropriate....

I have had problems with high exertion cycling such as steep hills

Is that because of the combination of pace and gradient or just the gradient?

or extended periods of cycling fast on slight gradients.

Where is the urge to cycle fast coming from? Do you ride with others and feel that you are slowing them down? Do you want to ride with others and avoid doing so?

Is it a case that you are not taking an ageing body into account and trying to do what you used to be able to do?

I'm of the opinion that riding a bike is a great thing to do and that anything that gets us riding more has to be a good thing.
However, there's a lot of people who think something like "If I just had X I'd do more of Y" and that isn't always the case. Especially on a focused forum like this where we're exposed to new and improved things all the time.

I am worried that I might get too used to the assistance and not ride my conventional bikes enough afterwards.

Can I ask what would be the problem if you did stop riding your conventional bikes? Is it just the fear of losing fitness?
Fitness, on its own is a funny thing. I think there are different kinds of fitness. Someone who races for an hour or two has a different fitness to someone who pootles all day long. There's mental fitness and physical fitness, too.

I'd imagine, and some of the responses above suggest, that physical fitness can be maintained or even improved by an Ebike. As with most things, it will come down to how you use it.

I'd think that if you focus on physical fitness, and physical fitness only, that you'll be pointed in one particular direction. If you take a wider perspective where enjoyment, relaxation, exploration, sociability, de-stressing or just the simple reduction of mental barriers and all the other things a bike can bring you, you may find that there are a number of options.

I met a group last summer on a collection of gravel/mtbs all out for a ride in glorious country, the "oldies" on E-bikes, the "youngsters" on acoustics and everyone was enjoying themselves. I know that because a lot of them slowed down to chat with me. If anyone was to drop out of that group because they felt that they couldn't keep up and that an Ebike would hamper their overall fitness I think that would be a great shame. Sure, they might be "fitter" by riding on their own but fitter for what?

 

[velohomme]

I have a road bike with the mahle system. In my opinion all the low power setting does is compensate for the extra weight of the bike but it's nice to know you have the backup of the other two settings. I try to ride on low power as much as possible so when I ride my steel vintage bikes (good weather only) I don't notice much difference even with the higher gearing.

 

[Dadam]

Please excuse my silly questions as a non e-bike rider, but does this mean that you get assistance to help you keep at or below 15.5mph, even on gradients, but the second you exceed that it switches off and you are suddenly relying 100% on leg power to get a 16kg bike to cruise at 16mph or beyond?

Others have answered the main question here, but I'd just like to add a little from my own experience. I've not ridden other e-bikes but I've had my Orbea Gain e-road bike since November. On the Gain I believe the assistance is designed to cut out gradually. If I'm on level 1 or 2 assist I often go past 15.5mph without noticing the lack of assist. Part of this is that it's light for an e-bike. Mine is an XL size frame and with the heavier Schwalbe gravel tyres I fitted weighs 16kg on my cheapo luggage scale. It's about the same weight as my Giant hybrid with its full rack and mudguards but feels much sprightlier to ride even with assist off. In my experience (aged 53, not the lightest or fittest) it's not at all hard to pedal it unassisted up to 20mph on the flat. The extra weight is irrelevant on the flat but would start to act against you on the inclines. So if you were able to maintain say 17-18 unassisted on a gentle slope on a light road bike you might feel that weight and drop back to where the motor is assisting. But the fact you're not using as much puff getting up the steeper stuff means you're not as knackered when you want to go faster than the cutoff.

I don't know if it's correct but I've read that a 10% tolerance is allowed with the 15.5mph "cut-off", which nominally would allow some assist up to 17mph. If true, it would fit with how the Gain feels around that cut-off speed. It's certainly not a sudden change.

Either way it's a great bike and my only real gripe is the lack of lugs for fitting mudguards. I'm looking forward to spring and planning some longer rides.

 

[youngoldbloke]

Please excuse my silly questions as a non e-bike rider, but does this mean that you get assistance to help you keep at or below 15.5mph, even on gradients, but the second you exceed that it switches off and you are suddenly relying 100% on leg power to get a 16kg bike to cruise at 16mph or beyond?

You can get as much or as little assistance as you require. Due to my health issues I use assistance much of the time but try to use as low a level as possible to conserve battery. I will change to Level 0 (no assistance) whenever I can, but will spend most of my time on a club ride in Level 1 'Eco' or 2 'Tour' (Mahle system) Level 3 'Boost' I use rarely, only on the steepest hills. I still have to put in quite a lot of effort if you want to match the speed of the group up to 15.5mph, and maintain it, much as you would on an unassisted bike, depending on gradient wind and so on. It doesn't give you a free ride!
I have a range extender battery on my bikes and a realistic range for me is around 70 miles. Of course the less you use the battery the longer the range possible. In addition to the alloy Orbea Gain I now also have a Ribble SLe, at under 12kg, one of the lightest e-road bikes you can buy - and I do find it makes a difference. (13kg + with the additional battery saddle pack etc). Given your leg issues I'd recommend buying the lightest e-road/gravel bike you can find/afford if you want to replicate the experience of riding your unassisted carbon bike.

 

[youngoldbloke]

I don't know if it's correct but I've read that a 10% tolerance is allowed with the 15.5mph "cut-off", which nominally would allow some assist up to 17mph. If true, it would fit with how the Gain feels around that cut-off speed. It's certainly not a sudden change.

I think you are right. On my bikes the cut off is a little over 15.5 mph. It seems to vary depending on the level of assistance - a bit higher in level 2, than 1. It also seems to vary between my bikes with the Ribble having a slightly higher cut off, maybe just over 16 mph.
To compare with Dadam, there's no way can I propel my bikes to 20mph without assistance! I can no longer ride my non-e carbon Rose Xeon (8kg) more than a couple of flat miles without pain - that's why I bought an e-road bike

 

[Dadam]

To compare with Dadam, there's no way can I propel my bikes to 20mph without assistance! I can no longer ride my non-e carbon Rose Xeon (8kg) more than a couple of flat miles without pain - that's why I bought an e-road bike

That's a shame but as long as the e-bike is helping you get out, it's a win!
To be clear, I can only propel it to that speed fairly briefly, I can't maintain it for long!

 

[Rusty Nails]

Not an E-bike owner and not someone who pays attention to performance so dismiss as appropriate....


Is that because of the combination of pace and gradient or just the gradient?


Where is the urge to cycle fast coming from? Do you ride with others and feel that you are slowing them down? Do you want to ride with others and avoid doing so?

Is it a case that you are not taking an ageing body into account and trying to do what you used to be able to do?

I'm of the opinion that riding a bike is a great thing to do and that anything that gets us riding more has to be a good thing.
However, there's a lot of people who think something like "If I just had X I'd do more of Y" and that isn't always the case. Especially on a focused forum like this where we're exposed to new and improved things all the time.


Can I ask what would be the problem if you did stop riding your conventional bikes? Is it just the fear of losing fitness?
Fitness, on its own is a funny thing. I think there are different kinds of fitness. Someone who races for an hour or two has a different fitness to someone who pootles all day long. There's mental fitness and physical fitness, too.

I'd imagine, and some of the responses above suggest, that physical fitness can be maintained or even improved by an Ebike. As with most things, it will come down to how you use it.

I'd think that if you focus on physical fitness, and physical fitness only, that you'll be pointed in one particular direction. If you take a wider perspective where enjoyment, relaxation, exploration, sociability, de-stressing or just the simple reduction of mental barriers and all the other things a bike can bring you, you may find that there are a number of options.

I met a group last summer on a collection of gravel/mtbs all out for a ride in glorious country, the "oldies" on E-bikes, the "youngsters" on acoustics and everyone was enjoying themselves. I know that because a lot of them slowed down to chat with me. If anyone was to drop out of that group because they felt that they couldn't keep up and that an Ebike would hamper their overall fitness I think that would be a great shame. Sure, they might be "fitter" by riding on their own but fitter for what?

The issues come from riding too hard for shortish steep climbs or too hard on longer slight gradients. I literally feel that I am going to pass out when I have to stop, but then after a minute or so am good to go again.

I do not ride with groups, other than occasionally with a couple of friends who are no faster than I am.

I must admit to quite enjoying challenging myself and am finding it very difficult to accept the natural limitations of an ageing body, and getting quite depressed about it.

I do not want to lose my fitness, but I also do not want to lose the enjoyment of rides that include an element of pleasure of the countryside as well as some hard work. Both make the ride for me.

One problem I have is that I always feel time-short because of other pressures and commitments and try to fit as much as possible into less than three hours (including a coffee stop) a few times a week.

I know an e-bike is on the horizon. I was in town this morning and called in just to see what they had in Evans. Waste of time, absolutely no drop bar bikes at all and none coming in.