dumbass LCC bike lane on Stratford High Street

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w00hoo_kent

One of the 64K
Look, the stats are out there. If you want to stick with anecdote that's your business, but don't pretend anecdote trumps science. I can't spare the time to discuss all aspects of your story, but about the dutch riding crap bike- well, bikes with only a rear drum brake functioning are legal there because the infra is good enough to make using such safe.
Much like a lot of the (I'll be generous here) debates on CC, I've seen a lot more faith than evidence quoted.

From talking to Dutch friends, those that enjoy riding bikes (as opposed to those that just use them as transport) have nice ones that they ride at the weekend nowhere near the city. This seemed accurate as we saw some much nicer bikes on the Saturday and Sunday when we were commuting in compared to the Friday and Monday last time round. The shite that they ride in the city, it's not that they only need a functioning rear brake (I'd be impressed if some of them had any functioning brakes at all and a fair number seemed to be defying physics just by being able to propel a human being forwards) is much less to do with legal requirements and much more to do with not giving a toss and what they can get away with without maiming themselves. I'm guessing the fact you don't go anywhere quickly helps here.
 

zimzum42

Legendary Member
This dude cannot seem to accept that for many cyclists, especially faster riders, major trunk roads are the safest roads for cycling - good surfaces, wide lanes, plenty of visibility, smooth gradients.

What's not to like?

I know some folk don't like being overtaken by trucks, but it's a mind over matter thing...
 

knocksofbeggarmen

Active Member
It's possible that posting 148 times on the forum on just one thread, on just one subject, might lead people to believe you have no interest in any other part of the forum.

I've seen the way this bunch behaves towards people who dare to express another view. In those circumstances, keeping my identity to myself when discussing a life and death issue like the ew/ns lanes is reasonable step. I realise it prevents me from posting full details of my latest tour/ trip times/ gear purchases etc. I note that anyone so at variance with certain opinion here will get treated as not a proper cyclist. Also it is part of the deal that to distract from any point I make I will get made into the subject, which is pretty much what happened to David Hembrow.

I can't think of a way out of this bind, given how arguments on this forum go. If you know of any, let me know.

I am content to expose the foolishness of some posters by provoking them to say what they actually think. I may add that I have received messages of support from cyclechatters not commenting here. They each of them, independently, volunteered the word 'bullying' to describe how dissident opinion is engaged with on this thread, I will stay anonymous.
 
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theclaud

Openly Marxist
Location
Swansea
I've seen the way this bunch behaves towards people who dare to express another view. In those circumstances, keeping my identity to myself when discussing a life and death issue like the ew/ns lanes is reasonable step. I realise it prevents me from posting full details of my latest tour/ trip times/ gear purchases etc. I note that anyone so at variance with certain opinion here will get treated as not a proper cyclist. Also it is part of the deal that to distract from any point I make I will get made into the subject, which is pretty much what happened to David Hembrow.

I can't think of a way out of this bind, given how arguments on this forum go. If you know of any, let me know.

I am content to expose the foolishness of some posters by provoking them to say what they actually think. I may add that I have received messages of support from cyclechatters not commenting here. They each of them, independently, volunteered the word 'bullying' to describe how dissident opinion is engaged with on this thread, I will stay anonymous.

What utter cobblers.
 

knocksofbeggarmen

Active Member
Ah the victim card.
No, I'm not the victim, and I intend to give as good as I get. But I recorded the experiences of others. And you might like to reflect on why this thread had not entertained the kind of focused evidence-based discussion you see below the line on blog posts. Degeneration into multi-commentator personal attack by way of anecdote is the norm here.
 
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knocksofbeggarmen

Active Member
You, as in 'the people in Amsterdam on bikes' that I had just been writing about. I have no idea if you go anywhere quickly on a bike so wouldn't wish to comment. Although if you were doing it in Amsterdam, you wouldn't be. By 'doing it' I mean riding a bike.

I see. Except I have been around Amsterdam on a bike. Quickly.
 

subaqua

What’s the point
Location
Leytonstone
I think it's wrong. On one ride with another Cyclenation group (not LCC), we did use a footway which you're not meant to ride on, so I brought it up with the ride guide, he said it was a mistake (easily done that one I think, because neighbouring sections of footway are shared-use) and the next time through that area we went a different way.

If you got no joy on the ride, did you try telling LCC HQ about this? I'd be surprised if it's encouraged.

I spoke to one of the leaders at the protest ride ( well I assume they were leaders as they were at the front and had the megaphones) and got the brush off. pointless when there seems to be a prevalent attitude of we will do what we like
 

knocksofbeggarmen

Active Member
This dude cannot seem to accept that for many cyclists, especially faster riders, major trunk roads are the safest roads for cycling - good surfaces, wide lanes, plenty of visibility, smooth gradients.

What's not to like?

I know some folk don't like being overtaken by trucks, but it's a mind over matter thing...

I accept that there's variety in cyclists and even that there are different kinds of traffic challenges I want to tackle depending on how fresh I am. The denial I detect in the reverse direction: many posters won't take it that segregated lanes would help get masses cycling, or, if they will, fall back on arguing that if masses cycled this would be a Bad Thing.
 

Dan B

Disengaged member
If you say "don't expect anyone who already cycles to support this" then my own case becomes relevant as a falsification of your theory. As would xThousand LCC members. None of which is a 'sample size of one' because we are not talking about a survey. Learn the meaning of 'sample size'.
But I didn't say that. I said "don't expect support from people already cycling if the most likely net effect is to make it worse for them."
I didn't say "from any of the people already cycling"
I didn't say "from people already cycling if the most likely net effect is to give them a safer and more pleasant route"
I said "don't expect support from people already cycling if the most likely net effect is to make it worse for them."

If you're not in this group of people then the fact that you support your own proposal is neither here nor there in respect to "falsification of my theory". You're a cyclist, you enjoy doing A, B, C whatever. That's great[*]. It doesn't mean there aren't other cyclists who prefer doing W, F, G and see your proposals as likely to make it more difficult or less pleasant for them to do so, and given the evident disdain in which you hold them it's hardly surprising that they don't trust you when you say that it'll all work out for them if they just stop trying to get in your way

[*] I mean that sincerely. I fall into both groups myself depending on what I'm doing, notwithstanding that taking my Christiana down the kerbed-off cycle track on Howland St was a dumb idea that I really won't ever be repeating. But you're exuding at least as much disrespect here as you're experiencing yourself and that's because you're treating the people you're talking to as kids and idiots
 
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