Dry or wet lube?

[Ridgeway]

I've recently started trying muc off dry lube. Definitely much cleaner, but seems to not last anywhere near as long as the wet lube; even in dry conditions I am having to reapply every 60 miles or so. I thought maybe I was doing something wrong, but other online reviewers seem to find the same. Other dry lubes are reported as lasting longer, but I haven't tried them.

exactly my experience with the same product, very clean but i need to apply a small amount before each ride.

wet lube is the devils spawn

 

[C R]

exactly my experience with the same product, very clean but i need to apply a small amount before each ride.

wet lube is the devils spawn

I find having to apply before/after every ride a bit annoying, but like how the chain stays clean, with the wet lube it was always black, no matter for how long I wiped and cleaned.

 

[faster]

Only my view but keeping the chain cassette and chainrings really clean and lubricate as required is the key, what lubricant or how you clean is all personal preference,
Have seen cyclists oiling dirty chains and can not help but think they might as well just be applying grinding paste, again only my view but even an old chain should look like new and the only way to tell its old would be to check the wear.
Only advice i would offer for lub would be little and often.

My experience has been the very opposite of this.

The 'grinding paste' comment comes up again and again on this forum when chain cleanliness is being discussed, and every time I read it, I wonder if the person saying it has ever actually used grinding paste.

When using grinding paste, the first thing that very quickly becomes apparent is how difficult it is to do any grinding with. For instance, in one of it's more common applications of grinding valves into valve seats, it only takes a couple of twirls with the twirly stick (or whatever they are called) and the grinding noise stops, followed by frantic tapping in an attempt to redistribute the paste to where it can actually do a bit more grinding.

I think the same process is at play in a chain - dirt is quickly displaced, and hopefully sticks to something where it will no longer do any damage. Most of the dirt is irrelevant and the only surfaces that really matter in wear terms is the interface between the pins and the inner bore of the inner plates, as only wear here affects the pitch of the chain. Roller wear and wear between the plates doesn't really matter.

The key to long chain life in nasty winter conditions is, in my opinion, is to have loads of nasty gunk between the plates, which forms a decent seal against further dirt getting to the pins. It also gives something for the dirt displaced from the working surfaces to stick to, to stop it flowing back to where it will do harm. If there is only liquid lube on the chain, the dirt just flows back to where it will do damage again and again.

A similar mechanism occurs in deep groove cartridge bearings. In a bearing which has been greased, the working surfaces stay free of wear metals as they are displaced and stick to the grease at the side of the bearing track, even when the grease is apparently quite dirty. If the same bearing is then cleaned and oiled, the wear metals constantly flow back to where they can do damage, and the bearing is noisy from the off and quickly destroys itself.

Other than wiping the outside and adding more lube, I never clean my chains, preferring to leave the factory grease in there until I bin it - once it's washed out, it's difficult to replace. They run silently.

On the few occasions where I've cleaned the chain thoroughly, I've ended up binning it shortly after due to grinding noises which never go away and rapid wear.

 

[Fab Foodie]

My experience has been the very opposite of this.

The 'grinding paste' comment comes up again and again on this forum when chain cleanliness is being discussed, and every time I read it, I wonder if the person saying it has ever actually used grinding paste.

When using grinding paste, the first thing that very quickly becomes apparent is how difficult it is to do any grinding with. For instance, in one of it's more common applications of grinding valves into valve seats, it only takes a couple of twirls with the twirly stick (or whatever they are called) and the grinding noise stops, followed by frantic tapping in an attempt to redistribute the paste to where it can actually do a bit more grinding.

I think the same process is at play in a chain - dirt is quickly displaced, and hopefully sticks to something where it will no longer do any damage. Most of the dirt is irrelevant and the only surfaces that really matter in wear terms is the interface between the pins and the inner bore of the inner plates, as only wear here affects the pitch of the chain. Roller wear and wear between the plates doesn't really matter.

The key to long chain life in nasty winter conditions is, in my opinion, is to have loads of nasty gunk between the plates, which forms a decent seal against further dirt getting to the pins. It also gives something for the dirt displaced from the working surfaces to stick to, to stop it flowing back to where it will do harm. If there is only liquid lube on the chain, the dirt just flows back to where it will do damage again and again.

A similar mechanism occurs in deep groove cartridge bearings. In a bearing which has been greased, the working surfaces stay free of wear metals as they are displaced and stick to the grease at the side of the bearing track, even when the grease is apparently quite dirty. If the same bearing is then cleaned and oiled, the wear metals constantly flow back to where they can do damage, and the bearing is noisy from the off and quickly destroys itself.

Other than wiping the outside and adding more lube, I never clean my chains, preferring to leave the factory grease in there until I bin it - once it's washed out, it's difficult to replace. They run silently.

On the few occasions where I've cleaned the chain thoroughly, I've ended up binning it shortly after due to grinding noises which never go away and rapid wear.

I tend to agree. Never really held with the grinding paste theory....

 

[Pale Rider]

GT85 on a rag and run the chain through it.

Do it before each ride. Takes a minute and keeps the chain clean.

I do the same.

No gunk on the chain or cassette, both of which are original and have done about 4,000 miles.

The bike is only used for occasional mostly sub-20 mile rides.

The system might not work as well for a more heavily used bike.

My distance bike has a Rohloff hub and a Chainglider which partly encloses the chain.

That will probably never wear out.

I give that chain an occasional squirt of GT85 because it does attract some road muck which dries and could cause stiff links.

 

[davidphilips]

My experience has been the very opposite of this.

The 'grinding paste' comment comes up again and again on this forum when chain cleanliness is being discussed, and every time I read it, I wonder if the person saying it has ever actually used grinding paste.

When using grinding paste, the first thing that very quickly becomes apparent is how difficult it is to do any grinding with. For instance, in one of it's more common applications of grinding valves into valve seats, it only takes a couple of twirls with the twirly stick (or whatever they are called) and the grinding noise stops, followed by frantic tapping in an attempt to redistribute the paste to where it can actually do a bit more grinding.

I think the same process is at play in a chain - dirt is quickly displaced, and hopefully sticks to something where it will no longer do any damage. Most of the dirt is irrelevant and the only surfaces that really matter in wear terms is the interface between the pins and the inner bore of the inner plates, as only wear here affects the pitch of the chain. Roller wear and wear between the plates doesn't really matter.

The key to long chain life in nasty winter conditions is, in my opinion, is to have loads of nasty gunk between the plates, which forms a decent seal against further dirt getting to the pins. It also gives something for the dirt displaced from the working surfaces to stick to, to stop it flowing back to where it will do harm. If there is only liquid lube on the chain, the dirt just flows back to where it will do damage again and again.

A similar mechanism occurs in deep groove cartridge bearings. In a bearing which has been greased, the working surfaces stay free of wear metals as they are displaced and stick to the grease at the side of the bearing track, even when the grease is apparently quite dirty. If the same bearing is then cleaned and oiled, the wear metals constantly flow back to where they can do damage, and the bearing is noisy from the off and quickly destroys itself.

Other than wiping the outside and adding more lube, I never clean my chains, preferring to leave the factory grease in there until I bin it - once it's washed out, it's difficult to replace. They run silently.

On the few occasions where I've cleaned the chain thoroughly, I've ended up binning it shortly after due to grinding noises which never go away and rapid wear.

Lol, In my case yes i have used grinding paste, perhaps a lot more than most. Up to your self what way you maintain your bike but take a look at this video.
The video is ok, but shows another opinion as to how clean a bike chain should be kept.
View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OF-osdIyuf8

 

[cougie uk]

Is that enough to keep the chain lubricated?

Works for me and the chain is kept clean. No nasty black grinding paste.

Got caught out in the rain yesterday 90 mins of really heavy stuff and the chain didn't squeak by the end.

It won't last a full day of wet riding - that's when you'd want the wet lube but you're best off cleaning the chain after anyway.

 

[cougie uk]

Its all ballaches IMO, don`t believe any of the marketing crap. I remember reading a pro mechanics comments about wet and dry lube and they use wet lube all the time no matter what. I just except that a need to clean and lube my chain once a week in summer depending on weather. In winter more frequently. I`ve also experimented with chainsaw oil and its just messy, does it work ? I`m sure it does but not for me !

Pro mechanics will be changing and cleaning the chain a heck of a lot more than us so it's not really relevant what they do.

 

[MrGrumpy]

Pro mechanics will be changing and cleaning the chain a heck of a lot more than us so it's not really relevant what they do.

Its very relevant I think ! Have you read some of the replies

 

[ianrauk]

Have seen cyclists oiling dirty chains and can not help but think they might as well just be applying grinding paste, again only my view but even an old chain should look like new and the only way to tell its old would be to check the wear.
Only advice i would offer for lub would be little and often.

Have seen this too. Gunk upon gunk.

 

[C R]

The wet lube definitely produces grinding paste, can hear it at the end of a wet ride.

 

[MrGrumpy]

Nah its your ears, I keep my chain clean as possible on the commuter, winter is harder. Change chain after approx 2000 miles, works for me. Wasted too long looking for the perfect snake oil for my chain. Just ride your bike and stop worrying about the small stuff.

 

[faster]

Lol, In my case yes i have used grinding paste, perhaps a lot more than most. Up to your self what way you maintain your bike but take a look at this video.
The video is ok, but shows another opinion as to how clean a bike chain should be kept.
View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OF-osdIyuf8

I've just watched this, and all he does is give the outside of the chain a wipe - similar to what I do really! I approve.

I was expecting something akin to what someone else on this forum suggested not long ago for chain maintenance, which involved multiple sets of pliers, solvents, brushes, washing with water, an oven to dry it, protective gloves and mask etc each time before oiling the chain.

 

[davidphilips]

I've just watched this, and all he does is give the outside of the chain a wipe - similar to what I do really! I approve.

I was expecting something akin to what someone else on this forum suggested not long ago for chain maintenance, which involved multiple sets of pliers, solvents, brushes, washing with water, an oven to dry it, protective gloves and mask etc each time before oiling the chain.

Know if the chain was really dirty it would take a lot more to clean it but little and often seems to work well ?

 

[Vantage]

Where's @Yellow Saddle when you need him!
I've long been an advocate of wet lube for year round use. The best I've had was White Lightning Wet Ride lube. Like any wet lube it does attract dirt but as long as it isn't plastered all over the chain its good for a few weeks if you keep the bike clean. Oil belongs inside the rollers, not outside them.
However, 6 days of near constant wet roads and tracks tested my latest favourite oil. Weldtite TF2 dry lube. I've detested the theory of dry lube for years. I mean, how the hell can a dry substance lubricate anything? Really. Well I was wrong. A week prior to my tour and throughout the tour, this stuff kept my chain running smoothly. Not a squeak. It was only on day 5 that I reapplied some lube as that day was spent on gritty as hell cycle tracks and the chain began grating a bit.
I can't speak for all dry lubes, but this one works and does what it's supposed to do.