Calling forum gun experts. How does a dummy firearm kill?

[T4tomo]

I believe there are about 1000 accidental deaths by firearm in the US annually. These include people shot by with their own guns by their own toddlers.

The US have a very lax attitude to gun safety, which is probably at the root of whatever went wrong in this case.

 

[Drago]

Blanks expell enough air and often wadding at high speed that they can be lethal within a metre of so, depending on the type of weapon. John Erik Hexum died playing russian roulette with blanks when the gas discharge was sufficient to drive a fragment of his skull into his brain.

Brandon Lee was a cluster-F. They wanted the revolver to look real in one scene, so technicians removed the powder and replaced the slugs on the shell casings,mso anyone viewing the cyclinder from front on would see 'real' bullets. However, they didn't remove the primer, and sure enough someone pulled the trigger and there was sufficient energy to drive a slug into the barrel. Later on the gun was used for another scene where it would be fired, so was loaded with blanks - blanks are essentually regualr rounds with a similar powder chargemto live ammo, but capped off with wax instead of a slug. The idiots knew nothing about gun safety and failed to check the weapon was clear, so missed the .44 round still stuck in the barrel. Filming started, the trigger was pulled, the gun went bang, and the .44 round shot out the barrel at pretty much the same velocity as a regular bullet, with unfortunate consequences.

Movie productions in the US tend to use real firearms - they're cheaper over there than dummies or replicas, and more convincing - so it likely the weapon was a real one, albeit loaded with blanks which would make it lethal within a close radius. The newsies are talking about it going off accidentally, which means a negligent discharge - they don't go off on their own,mits always the fault of poor handling. Still, there's nob all real info out there so thats conjecture.

Remember the 2 golden rules - never point a firearm at anything you don't want dead, and even when a firearm is unloaded you treat it as if it were. Follow those two rules assiduously and you're golden, but get even slightly careless or forgetful...

I believe there are about 1000 accidental deaths by firearm in the US annually. These include people shot by with their own guns by their own toddlers.

The US have a very lax attitude to gun safety, which is probably at the root of whatever went wrong in this case.

Negligence, not accidental.

 

[cougie uk]

Presumably there would have been a person on set responsible for the safety and loading of these things. They must be facing some tough questions right now.

If they were blanks - and that is what the reports suggest - wouldn't the final responsibility be with the person pointing the gun and pulling the trigger ?

 

[Joey Shabadoo]

That two people were victims suggests to me the weapon exploded. But that's pure speculation on my part.

 

[Supersuperleeds]

Re blanks. As a youth I was in the army cadets and on any exercise were blanks were being used, an adult used to get a plastic bag full of pig swill and fire a blank into it, the mess it made was enough to make sure we never pointed a rifle at anyone during the exercise. We were under strict instructions that a weapon was never to be pointed at anyone, even if not loaded.

We were also taught that if you passed a weapon to someone, you showed them the barrel was empty before handing it over (we weren't allowed to use pistols.)

 

[dodgy]

That two people were victims suggests to me the weapon exploded. But that's pure speculation on my part.

Or the round passed through one victim then into another.

 

[Beebo]

Or the round passed through one victim then into another.

That’s what the most recent report says.
“an eyewitness claiming that one "bullet" went straight through Ms Hutchins before hitting Mr Souza's clavicle”
Speculation also that Baldwin was given a “hot gun”.ie real bullets.

 

[Joey Shabadoo]

That’s what the most recent report says.
“an eyewitness claiming that one "bullet" went straight through Ms Hutchins before hitting Mr Souza's clavicle”
Speculation also that Baldwin was given a “hot gun”.ie real bullets.

ah, ok

 

[DRM]

Re blanks. As a youth I was in the army cadets and on any exercise were blanks were being used, an adult used to get a plastic bag full of pig swill and fire a blank into it, the mess it made was enough to make sure we never pointed a rifle at anyone during the exercise. We were under strict instructions that a weapon was never to be pointed at anyone, even if not loaded.

We were also taught that if you passed a weapon to someone, you showed them the barrel was empty before handing it over (we weren't allowed to use pistols.)

Same at the Air Training Corps, we had it hammered into us that you only point a weapon at someone you intend to kill, on the range you were given 5 rounds, and had to hand back 5 casings as well as showing that the rifle (WW1 era Lee Enfield 2.2) was clear, no messing or you didn’t do shooting again, and nobody wanted to miss out on that.
Though I’m sure nowadays there would have been an armed response police car outside with a load of teenagers doing rifle drill and marching about with them in full view.

 

[KnittyNorah]

I believe there are about 1000 accidental deaths by firearm in the US annually. These include people shot by with their own guns by their own toddlers.

There are vanishingly-few actual, real, 'accidents' with guns, anywhere in the world.

There is, however, a great deal of negligence and Americans do seem to excel at it.

When guns and/or ammunition - be they or it 'real' or 'blank' (of any kind) - have a presence, the very smallest degree of negligence can and often does result in tragedy.

I come from a family of gamekeepers and farriers for several generations past; I incline more to the farriery and horse side but had/have uncles, cousins and niblings on the shooting/gamekeeping side (a few also on the poaching side and a couple, dual purpose as it were ...) and learnt basic gun safety and handling as quite a small child. As an adult, I have been far more nervous around civilian gun owners in the US than I have those in the Middle East or Eastern Europe, as USians seem to be far more casual about them, and in casualness lies the seeds of tragedy where firearms are involved.

Just my opinion of course.

 

[Drago]

And in the forces the rifles are,fittedmp with a BFA when using blanks.

 

[cougie uk]

To save anyone else who's ignorant like me...

BFA- https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blank-firing_adaptor

 

[Alex321]

Negligence, not accidental.

Both actually, they are not mutually exclusive.

"Accident" does not mean unpreventable, as many seem to think. It just means an unintended consequence of an action.

 

[KnittyNorah]

Both actually, they are not mutually exclusive.

"Accident" does not mean unpreventable, as many seem to think. It just means an unintended consequence of an action.

Anything which is described as an 'accident' when firearms are involved will almost always be the consequence of a negligent action (or inaction) on someone's part. I don't have any statistics, but I'm thinking that inaction is probably the greater problem. Vanishingly-few 'accidents' with firearms are purely accidental;, though.

 

[Andy_R]

Both actually, they are not mutually exclusive.

"Accident" does not mean unpreventable, as many seem to think. It just means an unintended consequence of an action.

Let's just say someone drops a pistol, and it discharges a round that hits and kills someone. Accident, or not?