Bradford Cycle Lane
- Thread starter glenn forger
- Start date
-
- Tags
- cycle lane infrastructure
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growingvegetables
Guru
- Location
- Leeds
The biggest of the errors? Who is to blame.
Rumour (well-founded?) has it that the Leeds and Bradford cycling guys heard about the government funding, went out for a drink together, and hatched up some fantastical plan for a brilliant segregated cycling scheme on the back of an envelope. No harm in dreaming, they thought. The bid'll never fly, they thought. Not a snowball's chance in hell, they said .......
.......... and panicked mightily when the bid was accepted! Oh sh**!
But that's not where the blame lies.
It does lie squarely with three (I believe) guys, whose job in the authority is, effectively, to play Grand Theft Auto. All day. Every day. OK - it's not actually GTA, but it IS a computer simulation game, modelling traffic flows.
Their job is to maximise motor traffic flow. Nothing else. Whatever idea for road improvement comes up, has to pass by them. They model its effect on motorised traffic flow with their game.
If flow speeds up (on their model!), idea gets the go ahead; so we get extra, narrower lanes squeezed into what was once a comfortable two lane street. That's not a problem for them, it's a solution. (It may be a problem for me on the bike, but I don't count.)
But if there is the slightest hindrance to the flow of motorised vehicles, these three guys have the power of veto. Absolute. Definitive. No way, José. Cyclists? Pedestrians? The short pier's that way - take a long walk.
I look at some of the stuff that's happening in London now - and compare it with what we've got. What we'll have to live with for the next 30 years.
PMarkey
Guru
- Location
- Queensbury,West Yorkshire
Bradford has always bowed low to the great god "CAR" just look at the nightmare that is the Shipley Airdale road or the city centre and who could ever forget the great Manchester road bus lane debacle ?
Paul
Paul
mjr
Comfy armchair to one person & a plank to the next
- Location
- mostly Norfolk, sometimes Somerset
Oh it's worse than that. You do count. As a drawback. In certain circumstances. Light-controlled crossings like cycle early start lights (bike symbols) or toucans/puffins (where a cycle track crosses a carriageway) count, which is why Leeds cyclists can't get "green wave" effects (let alone actual green wave or countdown lights).
But worthless uncontrolled "courtesy" crossings where motorists are expected to let cyclists cross when they are not required to (hah! Yeah, right!) don't count, which is why we only get that unsafe crap at some junctions - until some people get injured and they can appeal to a casualty reduction argument for overruling the motoring flow. But of course, if a crossing is obviously worthless and there's any half-decent alternative, people aren't going to sacrifice themselves for the greater good, they're just going to be deflected to the alternative... or if there are too many such deflections, it may encourage them to switch to motor transport.
There are two silver linings:
First, I think the new "tiger" crossings (where a cycle track crosses alongside a zebra crossing) don't yet count in the most common obnoxious modelling packages (Linsig, Arcady and so on), so try pushing for those. This is probably a temporary thing, though.
Secondly, there's a modelling package called Vissim which does count cycling and walking, so try pushing for that to be used for roads/junctions which are meant to be on strategic cycling and walking routes. Most councils refuse to use it, but that can be a press story in itself ("Council refuses to cater for humans" type stuff).
I used the Canal Rd greenway on Monday, it was very pleasant from Shipley, but far from being a Shipley to Bradford centre route as is claimed, it peters out and then onto Bradford's busiest road 1.5 miles short!
The money wasted on the superhighway would have been better spent improving and widening the canal towpath. Providing a dedicated cycling lane from Leeds to Skipton along the ..........flat........Aire Valley.
I am giving it up soon, I can't cross Bradford for much longer, I am fine in traffic but the recent trend for pavement driving, with apparent impunity, is step too far for me, if driving on the pavements is ok, then I'm out.
Last edited:
steveindenmark
Legendary Member
I was out on a 70km ride yesterday and a 50km ride today and it was great. Lots of super smooth, wide cycle paths with very few cyclists out. I passed the workman building another 5 mile section of cyclepath with a lovely bridge and pond. All the traffic at junctions gave way to me. Nobody honked or shouted abuse at me and on the sections where there was no cycle path I was given lots of room. I never felt in danger.
Im not surprised. Its been like this for 13 years.
I feel sorry for you lot. Who needs a holiday in Denmark
Im not surprised. Its been like this for 13 years.
I feel sorry for you lot. Who needs a holiday in Denmark
classic33
Leg End Member
Try one in Leeds or Bradford. It'll make you appreciate what you have got all the more.I was out on a 70km ride yesterday and a 50km ride today and it was great. Lots of super smooth, wide cycle paths with very few cyclists out. I passed the workman building another 5 mile section of cyclepath with a lovely bridge and pond. All the traffic at junctions gave way to me. Nobody honked or shouted abuse at me and on the sections where there was no cycle path I was given lots of room. I never felt in danger.
Im not surprised. Its been like this for 13 years.
I feel sorry for you lot. Who needs a holiday in Denmark
classic33
Leg End Member
One of those three we had in Calderdale, before he moved onto Kirklee'sThe biggest of the errors? Who is to blame.
Rumour (well-founded?) has it that the Leeds and Bradford cycling guys heard about the government funding, went out for a drink together, and hatched up some fantastical plan for a brilliant segregated cycling scheme on the back of an envelope. No harm in dreaming, they thought. The bid'll never fly, they thought. Not a snowball's chance in hell, they said .......
.......... and panicked mightily when the bid was accepted! Oh sh**!
But that's not where the blame lies.
It does lie squarely with three (I believe) guys, whose job in the authority is, effectively, to play Grand Theft Auto. All day. Every day. OK - it's not actually GTA, but it IS a computer simulation game, modelling traffic flows.
Their job is to maximise motor traffic flow. Nothing else. Whatever idea for road improvement comes up, has to pass by them. They model its effect on motorised traffic flow with their game.
If flow speeds up (on their model!), idea gets the go ahead; so we get extra, narrower lanes squeezed into what was once a comfortable two lane street. That's not a problem for them, it's a solution. (It may be a problem for me on the bike, but I don't count.)
But if there is the slightest hindrance to the flow of motorised vehicles, these three guys have the power of veto. Absolute. Definitive. No way, José. Cyclists? Pedestrians? The short pier's that way - take a long walk.
I look at some of the stuff that's happening in London now - and compare it with what we've got. What we'll have to live with for the next 30 years.
You misunderstand the purpose of this. This is on Church HIll, a rather steep road out of the centre of Bradford. They have generously provided a safe and secure parking facility for your bike while you recover your breath after the steepest section. You can then unlock your bike, push it across the side road and along the pavement until you reach a part of the gradient where you feel able to start riding again.
Obvs
classic33
Leg End Member
You mean Church Bank, (City Cathedral)! Church Hill is Baildon, I'm trusting my A-Z on this one.
classic33
Leg End Member
Absinthe Minded
Guest
What has having been to Bradford got to do with it?
Oh, is that not OK; does it say that somewhere? No? So why mention it?
classic33
Leg End Member
You'll struggle to find a white taxi driver, so the point made was valid without correction.
Absinthe Minded
Guest
The point under examination was that of drivers parking in cycle lanes, what relevance is their colour? Also, you have quoted my point regarding reply time frame, but you have neglected to address it. Feel free to air your views here as well.
