Another +ve

[doyler78]

Yes I know what you are saying Chuffles but in the reports of the other 2 cheats they were nicked off down to the station whilst their Hotel room was searched,thrown out but Team left in. This time it seems a lot more action has taken place. Cars and Buses searched Team withdraws leading me to think its not just Ricco at Saunier Duval.

That assumes we were given a full account in the other stories of what took place. As it is a criminal offence to dope in France it would be a really serious failing in the police investigation if the team buses and cars were not searched but who knows. Maybe that will come out later.

 

[Flying_Monkey]

Looks like Ricco was copying Pantani in more ways than one then eh? But seriously, if the whole team have pulled out, it can only mean that they are acknowledging that they knew - unlike Barloworld or Liquigas who are claiming they did not.

 

[doyler78]

Looks like Ricco was copying Pantani in more ways than one then eh? But seriously, if the whole team have pulled out, it can only mean that they are acknowledging that they knew - unlike Barloworld or Liquigas who are claiming they did not.

No what the team has said is that they pulled out because the rider in question was Ricco and Ricco isn't just any rider, he was a top rider and until they could investigate the extent of the problem and to protect cycling from further damage they would be withdrawing not just from the TdF but from all racing. That says to me that they may suspect that they may have a more widespread problem however they are going to make damn sure they get to the bottom of it and sort before they do anything else.

That's all that can be asked of them and until I see any evidence that there was management knowledge or help in his doping then I will take it at that.

 

[Lardyboy]

Heard about it on the radio earlier. What was he thinking? If he was under suspicion already, did he feel so insecure in his "ability" that he needed to dope again? The mind boggles!

 

[Chuffy]

Yes I know what you are saying Chuffles but in the reports of the other 2 cheats they were nicked off down to the station whilst their Hotel room was searched,thrown out but Team left in. This time it seems a lot more action has taken place. Cars and Buses searched Team withdraws leading me to think its not just Ricco at Saunier Duval.

Yes, it occured to me a bit later that was what you actually meant. But as doyler78 says, it would be remiss of Le Fuzz not to at least search the other teams in full, rather than just focus on the one rider.
As for teams pulling out, or not, it seems to be down to the way that the team management (and presumably the sponsors too) feel. I guess that S-D felt that there was too much risk of other riders in the team (esp if Ricco had been involved in selection) being implicated, so pulled out. If more teams did that (like Cofidis and T-Mobile last year) would there be more peer pressure among the riders not to dope, if the risk was not just to yourself, but to your fellow riders? I can't imagine that the clean riders on S-D would give Ricco the steam off their piss right now, let alone do him any professional favours once he's served his ban.

 

[andy_wrx]

After the way Piepoli and Cobo shot up Hautacam the other day, I don't believe Ricco was the only bent S-D boilerman.

Schleck couldn't live with them and looked half-dead when he came-in 30secs down, shirt open and gasping.

 

[Flying_Monkey]

After the way Piepoli and Cobo shot up Hautacam the other day, I don't believe Ricco was the only bent S-D boilerman.

Schleck couldn't live with them and looked half-dead when he came-in 30secs down, shirt open and gasping.

That is starting to be my suspicion now too...

 

[marinyork]

I didn't watch the tour properly last year, it's first proper one this year but I had heard about Rasmussen and other things. Do people think this Ricco business is nearly as big as last year's problems?

 

[Tetedelacourse]

Hard to compare the Rasmussen case - he wasn't thrown out for doping, he was thrown out for lying to his employer and that was discovered/ dealt with when he was in yellow.

I for one was happy to see Cofidis and T: Mobile leaving en masse. Finally some acknowledgement on behalf of hte organisers that doping is institutionalised, not just the whim of the rider. I think that if the team were to get the boot each time it happened, then it would support the fight against cheating from team mgt and team members and backstaff. I thought it was getting somewhere.

Of course, the drugs have got more advanced too and unluckily for Ricco the testing has just about caught up.

This year isn't AS bad YET as last when you factor in Vino and Kasheshkin and Astana IMO. Ricco has come from nowhere in TDF terms. Vino was a seasoned pro and pretty outspoken against drugs. Ras getting the boot while in yellow added to the farce. This all in spite of the "charter" remember!

Certainly not as bad as 2006 - OP on the eve of the race and then the yellow jersey in Paris gets the boot too. Awful.

Let's see what crops up in the alps. Somehow I can't believe that's the end of the scandal for this year.

 

[doyler78]

I think its bigger because everyone has talked this tour up as though it was going to be end word in clean competition and that all the young riders out there are not doping and it is only the old guard that has to be got rid off.

Well that's been blown apart today just like Ricco blew his rivals apart.

You only have to read this thread to see that every above average performance is now being questioned which is very bad for the sport because of the fans don't have confidence in the professional sport any more then how the hell can you expect non cycling fans to admire the extraordinary efforts of those riders who are clean.

 

[Tetedelacourse]

I disagree. We've been here before and the casualties were bigger in the past. As I say though, so far

 

[doyler78]

I look at it from the other side. They came from an era where doping is known to have been widespread and institutionalised and as such to find stars amongst those that doped was not as shocking as it was predictable.

All I have heard this year from the cycling press is talk about everyone thought cycling had turned the corner in its battle against doping and that it was now a minority thing that had been banished to the old guard who brought up in that different era.

What Ricco and the other youngsters represented was a new breed of rider who fought cleanly and excelled because of his extraordinary talent. What this has done to shake the whole foundations own which that thinking is based.

This view has been sold to the public and when it falls apart it actually perpetuates a view that cycling has as much of a problem now as it ever did and that causes a major problem because unless it is pereceived to have got better then each year cycling loses more credibility and that's why this year is a bigger disaster. As you say Ricco's main problem is that he got caught because technology caught up with him.

What this shows me is that doping is not something that we are going to eliminate any time soon, if ever.

 

[HLaB]

Just my theory but could this be one of the reasons why David Millar left Saunier Duval:?:

 

[Chuffy]

Just my theory but could this be one of the reasons why David Millar left Saunier Duval:?:

It's a depressing thought that someone like Millar would leave a team for that reason and say nothing. If it were true it suggests that clean cyclists are too frightened to blow the whistle and the old code of silence is as strong as ever.

 

[Noodley]

It's a depressing thought that someone like Millar would leave a team for that reason and say nothing. If it were true it suggests that clean cyclists are too frightened to blow the whistle and the old code of silence is as strong as ever.

IIRC he did alert UCI to the less than clean practices at Saunier. UCI did as UCI do best - fack all.

There's a good article in ProCycling this month about Festina.

I have now reached the stage where I no longer require 'evidence' to the degree which is required to 'convict' a rider.

My list is long....