Zwift Chat

[CXRAndy]

I have Andy.
Some living in Rome and some in the Abruzzo region close to the finish for stage 10 of the Giro this year!!

Sent PM

 

[bobinski]

One of the team we are racing tonight has 3riders who are really A .
one is a 4.7w/k over 20 min and another who is 4.3. and the 3rd 4.2. None lightweights and their team was fastest in the TTT.

 

[Del C]

Just the 16 or so A riders in our B race tonight.

This is going to be hard!

Rank	Rider		Age		20min	20min	15sec	15sec	UCI Lap	Libby Hill	Last ride together
A	B	391.98	Manuel Liebenow (BMPRO)BMPRO	69.0kg	Mas	180cm	4.4 wkg	304 w	10.9 wkg	754 w		02:04 288w 4.2wkg
A	B	257.42	Laurens Seigers (BZR Lions 1)BZR cycling team	75.0kg	Snr	178cm	4.4 wkg	334 w	11.8 wkg	900 w	21:00 310w 4.1wkg	01:14 500w 6.7wkg
A	B	295.70	Tom Schyvens (BZR Lions 1)BZR cycling team	71.0kg	Mas	181cm	4.3 wkg	305 w	10.1 wkg	720 w	21:25 305w 4.3wkg	01:16 450w 6.3wkg
A	B	280.53	Tommy Leunen (BZR Lions 4)BZR cycling team	67.4kg	Mas	186cm	4.5 wkg	306 w	12.5 wkg	844 w	22:59 270w 4.0wkg	01:24 405w 6.0wkg
A	B	324.11	Werner Keppens (BZR Lions 3)BZR cycling team	70.0kg	Vet	174cm	4.4 wkg	308 w	11.0 wkg	770 w	21:48 276w 3.9wkg	01:26 370w 5.3wkg
A	B	591.21	Chris G (CWCC)CWCC	70.0kg	Vet	168cm	4.7 wkg	328 w	6.3 wkg	443 w	23:24 276w 3.9wkg	01:56 283w 4.0wkg
A	B	252.49	Martin Anhoej (DBR Tornadoes)DBR	80.0kg	Mas	184cm	4.4 wkg	351 w	13.0 wkg	1,038 w	20:57 340w 4.3wkg	01:07 594w 7.4wkg
A	B	278.10	Dennis van der Salm (EVO VORTEX 1)EVOLUTION	77.0kg	Mas	189cm	4.2 wkg	327 w	10.4 wkg	823 w	26:46 212w 2.8wkg	02:09 299w 3.9wkg
A	B	368.72	Olli K (KC-B2)KIRCHMAIR e-Cycling	65.0kg	50+	178cm	4.3 wkg	280 w	8.7 wkg	563 w		01:35 317w 4.9wkg
A	B	351.57	Simon Coles (R3R ACDC)Race3R	77.0kg	50+	183cm	4.3 wkg	329 w	8.0 wkg	615 w	23:36 300w 3.9wkg	01:44 355w 4.6wkg
A	B	345.10	Anders Olsson (SZ Forsete)SZ	66.0kg	50+	165cm	4.5 wkg	298 w	8.2 wkg	539 w	22:51 478w 7.2wkg	01:33 295w 4.5wkg
A	B	307.60	Rob Dallimore (CRYO-GEN ZONCOLAN)Team CRYO-GEN	71.0kg	Vet	179cm	4.3 wkg	301 w	10.4 wkg	741 w	22:56 362w 5.1wkg	01:30 389w 5.5wkg
A	B	313.88	Lukas Eugster [TV] (Dainsleif)Valhalla	79.0kg	Snr	190cm	4.4 wkg	349 w	13.1 wkg	1,037 w	23:07 302w 3.8wkg	01:32 387w 4.9wkg
A	B	488.34	rbnss78 (ZESP Ardillas) ZESP	75.0kg	Vet	177cm	4.4 wkg	326 w	13.6 wkg	995 w
A	B	427.62	Vicente Escudero (ZESP Ardillas)ZESP	65.0kg	Vet	177cm	4.4 wkg	289 w	11.9 wkg	774 w	24:02 267w 4.1wkg	01:41 316w 4.9wkg
A	B	269.64	Thomas Peffer [ZRG] (WP-3)

 

[<Tommy>]

Is it because they have been promoted since the league started?

 

[mjd1988]

It's rife. Around 20% of the c racers are now pretty good b's in some groups.

 

[bobinski]

Is it because they have been promoted since the league started?

You mean during races 1 and 2? but then so many are people who have come to zwift during summer/covid and so racing numbers are relatively recent. The point of the races was to filter and then place in the right division within the league.

 

[Del C]

Is it because they have been promoted since the league started?

I don’t know but I guess so.

The rules did say that you stayed at the Cat you started the league at.

I do know that they’ve put quite a bit of effort into checking results and weeding out sandbaggers. I’ve seen examples of people being DQd, either because their numbers were just too high or because WTRL could track back to earlier Zwiftpower records and caught some people who had taken a break and came back at an unrealistic level.

I did see some numbers but can’t remember them. They weren’t massive numbers but more than you’d normally see in standard Zwift races.

 

[bridgy]

You mean during races 1 and 2? but then so many are people who have come to zwift during summer/covid and so racing numbers are relatively recent. The point of the races was to filter and then place in the right division within the league.

I think this is the problem - some rather cynically gaming the Category system having not raced for a while, and others more innocently turning out to be a higher Cat now they've picked up racing again. WTRL kind of walked into this problem by saying if you went up a Cat during the league you could stay in the lower Cat team you started in.

 

[mjd1988]

I think this is the problem - some rather cynically gaming the Category system having not raced for a while, and others more innocently turning out to be a higher Cat now they've picked up racing again. WTRL kind of walked into this problem by saying if you went up a Cat during the league you could stay in the lower Cat team you started in.

Agreed. Their motives were good, and I completely agree that there are people who progress fairly halfway through a league and it's not fair they miss out, but some people are exploiting it big time.

 

[<Tommy>]

You mean during races 1 and 2? but then so many are people who have come to zwift during summer/covid and so racing numbers are relatively recent. The point of the races was to filter and then place in the right division within the league.

If that was their intention then maybe they’re people who have slipped through the net? Or alternately they have looked at them and decided they weren’t sand bagging?

Like Bridgy says they set this stool out before the series didn’t they. I personally don’t think it’s black and white. Burninglegs was A cat before his hiatus and possibly new power meter (?). Now he’s back in B. If he gets promoted again then I guess people who don’t know him would throw that demotion / subsequent promotion at him.But we know different and that’s it’s just the way it’s panned out. Dunno... I guess to save yourself letting it wind you up you’ve just got to go with it to a degree.

My personal preference would be completely ignoring the catergory boundaries and let the strength of the teams dictate where they ultimately end up. Like in most team sport.

 

[Joffey]

If that was their intention then maybe they’re people who have slipped through the net? Or alternately they have looked at them and decided they weren’t sand bagging?

Like Bridgy says they set this stool out before the series didn’t they. I personally don’t think it’s black and white. Burninglegs was A cat before his hiatus and possibly new power meter (?). Now he’s back in B. If he gets promoted again then I guess people who don’t know him would throw that demotion / subsequent promotion at him.But we know different and that’s it’s just the way it’s planned out. Dunno... I guess to save yourself letting it wind you up you’ve just got to go with it to a degree.

My personal preference would be completely ignoring the catergory boundaries and let the strength of the teams dictate where they ultimately end up. Like in most team sport.

Yeah, I think this also. It was always going to be a hard job but adding Cat boundaries in was always going to make it even more complicated.

 

[<Tommy>]

I have a feeling a lot of the guys who have been bumped up have been bumped up because they’ve started using the turbo again after being outside in the summer.

So question: if you were A Cat the last spring, but had been demoted to B or lower through lack of racing through the summer. Would you join A even if you weren’t showing as an A? Or would you join B?

 

[bobinski]

The thing is they have already removed some that were clearly over cat after the 2 races.
WRTL have replied to my email saying;

Riders will be DQ’d in the results if they go way above the Category limits. We will do our best to catch them.

Which suggests they will continue to fillet the divisions where they it right to do so. The 4.7 W/k in our group clearly improved over the 2 races but that should have been enough to bump him into A whichever way you look at it. TBH his teams times were quickest in our division and I am surprised they are not in a stronger group.

 

[bridgy]

Yeah to be fair Bob, that rider who has done 4.7w/kg 20 min power in particular doesn't look right on ZP - I'm surprised WTRL haven't picked up on it.

He's only done 4 rides/races on Zwift before the TTT - three in July and one the day before the TTT (to get a ZP Category I suspect?). All 4 of those rides were at 3.3w/kg with average HR between 149 and 156bpm. Then he does the TTT at 4.3w/kg (and 20 minutes at 4.7), and his heart rate DROPS down to 137bpm as well! I want some of whatever he's on!

If he wins the race tonight you and I probably won't be the only ones taking a closer look at those results of his on ZP!

 

[bobinski]

Yeah to be fair Bob, that rider who has done 4.7w/kg 20 min power in particular doesn't look right on ZP - I'm surprised WTRL haven't picked up on it.

He's only done 4 rides/races on Zwift before the TTT - three in July and one the day before the TTT (to get a ZP Category I suspect?). All 4 of those rides were at 3.3w/kg with average HR between 149 and 156bpm. Then he does the TTT at 4.3w/kg (and 20 minutes at 4.7), and his heart rate DROPS down to 137bpm as well! I want some of whatever he's on!

If he wins the race tonight you and I probably won't be the only ones taking a closer look at those results of his on ZP!

😁
His Captain is taking a huge risk though because the whole team could be disqualified.