Woman convicted of manslaughter after swearing and gesturing at 77 year old cyclist.

[mjr]

I’m unsure what sending her to prison will do.

Stop her road-raging at others for a few months at least, and perhaps, if time brings some reflection, motivate some healing or therapy to reduce angry outbursts?

 

[Deleted member 35268]

Sorry to go on a slight tangent. Last week i was on a shared path along a dual carriageway and some other cyclists were coming the other way (plenty of space, as we crossed paths one of the other cyclists made a loud barking noise ( to annoy me ). This has been going on for months every time we cross paths. In the winter, in the pitch black and they have no lights one of the pair does the same thing. In the context of the incident of this page, if I was to have an accident as a result of being startled, this could land the culprit in serious trouble ? I've got a GoPro to capture this occurance a few times as it is really getting on my nerves. I started avoiding the route which puts me on a road (not the dual carriageway) - Thoughts please.

 

[fossyant]

No excuses. It does appear the cyclist was shoved. She also carried on some distance to Sainsburys. Horrible individual, disability or not. The 77 year old was not going quickly, I'd say walking pace looking at the video.

She'd have got away with it if she was in a car.

 

[fossyant]

Sorry to go on a slight tangent. Last week i was on a shared path along a dual carriageway and some other cyclists were coming the other way (plenty of space, as we crossed paths one of the other cyclists made a loud barking noise ( to annoy me ). This has been going on for months every time we cross paths. In the winter, in the pitch black and they have no lights one of the pair does the same thing. In the context of the incident of this page, if I was to have an accident as a result of being startled, this could land the culprit in serious trouble ? I've got a GoPro to capture this occurance a few times as it is really getting on my nerves. I started avoiding the route which puts me on a road (not the dual carriageway) - Thoughts please.

Swing your arm out in shock, just make sure it hits them in the face.

 

[mjr]

In the winter, in the pitch black and they have no lights one of the pair does the same thing. In the context of the incident of this page, if I was to have an accident as a result of being startled, this could land the culprit in serious trouble ? I've got a GoPro to capture this occurance a few times as it is really getting on my nerves. I started avoiding the route which puts me on a road (not the dual carriageway) - Thoughts please.

Yes, it seems likely to land the culprit in trouble. In theory, it shouldn't require you to be injured or not, it's their disproportionate verbal assault which is probably unlawful. If you're not killed, I think the charge would be assault not manslaughter.

Have you captured it on video? If it's a predictable time, I'd report it to the police, but I supect they may well decide to go for the easy win of fining them £50 each for no lights, possibly repeatedly when they have an officer available at the right time, while warning them that it might not have been caught on video if they hadn't kept shouting (barking) at other people.

 

[mjr]

Swing your arm out in shock, just make sure it hits them in the face.

Twisted thought: I wonder if you could legitimately say that you were waving your metal pump to fend off the "dog", as advised by "Richard's Bicycle Book"?

 

[tom73]

The CCTV has done for her.
Without the CCTV this would have been just an unfortunate event.
I’m unsure what sending her to prison will do.
I’d much rather see drivers get similar punishments.

This case would have been better dealt with via restorative justice sentence. However her unwillingness to even show the slightest understanding that her actions had consequences. Which in turn leads to lack of understanding of consequences of offending , which form a key part of restorative justice. Together with her over all conduct in court and leading up to it. Indicate that that she mostly would have failed to engage with in the restorative justice process and sentence. All of which will have will have left the judge with little choice but to move to a prison sentence.

 

[fossyant]

Restorative justice for killing someone. Nah, hanging would be too good.

 

[numbnuts]

The way I see it -
She can't see very well, but she thought that some scumbag was riding a bike on the pavement and gave some verbal abuse to the rider.
Said rider then fall off into the road and gets hit by car.
She then panics and legs it to Sainsbury as she didn't want to talk to the police.
Guilty of her actions – yes, but I don't think she should have gone to prison, what good it is going to do, well maybe she won't do it again.

 

[All uphill]

I may have raised my voice to inform people cycling on the footpath that they should be on the road, while I am out walking.

Does this make me overdue a prison sentence?

 

[mjr]

The way I see it -
She can't see very well, but she thought that some scumbag was riding a bike on the pavement and gave some verbal abuse to the rider.
Said rider then fall off into the road and gets hit by car.
She then panics and legs it to Sainsbury as she didn't want to talk to the police.
Guilty of her actions – yes, but I don't think she should have gone to prison, what good it is going to do, well maybe she won't do it again.

Well, not while she's locked up, anyway! And maybe she'll get some help for that road rage tendency while inside.

I really struggle to understand people on here arguing that basically committing an unprovoked assault ending in death should not carry a prison sentence.

I doubt that an OAP on a small wheel shopper looked or moved anything like a "scumbag" even to her eyesight, given that the time between her starting shouting abuse and the bike appearing on camera suggests the victim would have been, what, 15-20m away at most? The attacker had no white stick, not even a symbol cane, so her sight wasn't bad enough that she wanted to ask other road users for extra care. I suspect she saw a soft target for her rage, maybe including rage from some previous incident with a "scumbag" on something more clearly a footway than this one.

 

[Red17]

The way I see it -

She can't see very well, but she thought that some scumbag was riding a bike on the pavement and gave some verbal abuse to the rider.

Said rider then fall off into the road and gets hit by car.

She then panics and legs it to Sainsbury as she didn't want to talk to the police.

Guilty of her actions – yes, but I don't think she should have gone to prison, what good it is going to do, well maybe she won't do it again.


Her totally unnecessary actions caused someone to die. Prison seems an appropriate response IMO

 

[mjr]

I may have raised my voice to inform people cycling on the footpath that they should be on the road, while I am out walking.

Does this make me overdue a prison sentence?

Did you shout and swear to intimidate them? Did you walk on the left to obstruct their passage? Did you raise your arms in a shoving motion? If no to all three, then probably not, but take care not to become a roadrager in future. Also might be a good idea to be really sure it's not a cycleway too, and to remember the Boateng advice that people finding the road too hostile shouldn't be prosecuted for careful cycling along footways (which I feel is fixing the wrong problem, but it's what we've got).

 

[a.twiddler]

Sorry to go on a slight tangent. Last week i was on a shared path along a dual carriageway and some other cyclists were coming the other way (plenty of space, as we crossed paths one of the other cyclists made a loud barking noise ( to annoy me ). This has been going on for months every time we cross paths. In the winter, in the pitch black and they have no lights one of the pair does the same thing. In the context of the incident of this page, if I was to have an accident as a result of being startled, this could land the culprit in serious trouble ? I've got a GoPro to capture this occurance a few times as it is really getting on my nerves. I started avoiding the route which puts me on a road (not the dual carriageway) - Thoughts please.

At the risk of starting a decibel arms race, perhaps get your self an Airzound or similar. If you are prepared enough, with your finger on the trigger, as soon as he opens his mouth, drown him out. Should only take a couple of occasions before he thinks it's not worth it. If you can train dogs, you can train humans too. The danger is, next time you see him he might have something even louder on his handlebars. Alternatively, is there something about your bike or riding that triggers this behaviour? Perhaps he just thinks it's funny to do this to random cyclists. The situation might resolve itself if on one occasion he just does it to the wrong person and gets unexpected retribution. What goes around, comes around.

 

[Deleted member 35268]

At the risk of starting a decibel arms race, perhaps get your self an Airzound or similar. If you are prepared enough, with your finger on the trigger, as soon as he opens his mouth, drown him out. Should only take a couple of occasions before he thinks it's not worth it. If you can train dogs, you can train humans too. The danger is, next time you see him he might have something even louder on his handlebars. Alternatively, is there something about your bike or riding that triggers this behaviour? Perhaps he just thinks it's funny to do this to random cyclists. The situation might resolve itself if on one occasion he just does it to the wrong person and gets unexpected retribution. What goes around, comes around.

I was considering something along those lines to a) scare the **** out of him and b) get one over on him. I think i AM the wrong person he wants to mess with.