What is the best level of quality of Shimano group-set before it is just about weight.

[Richard A Thackeray]

The (2010) Ridley has Ultegra, which works great, & is is fairly silent/smooth

The new Ribble 'winter' (aluminium) has Tiagra, which is fine, but, seems to have a 'click' in between gears for some reason?????
It also clunks sometimes on up changes on the cassette

The Dyna-Tech (1994) has 8-speed Ultegra, still works fine, but does refuse to change up (higher gear) at times, but given its age, I'll put it down to wear & tear?

(2008) Cross-bike has 105, that's a bit clunky, but the levers have been full of mud/washed out a few times


As for the weight/cost question;
Using Ribble for examples
11 speed Ultegra cassette (11-23) 221grams = £47.96
10 speed Tiagra (11-25) 261grams = £17.56

So a fair difference for 40 grams

Then, if you want to spend BIG money (or can justify it) 10-speed Dura-Ace; 11-23 weighs 163 grams!!!!

 

[Chris432626]

I went from 105 to ultegra, cannot really tell a difference, 105 is very good value.

 

[Cyclopathic]

That's the thing about 'perform'. It is open to interpretation.
For instance steel will surely perform better than aluminium, but with a weight cost.

For my purposes performance does not include light weight. I am interested in components that work well and are reliable and durable. The saving of a few grammes here and there or even a couple of kilos over a whole bike is really not an issue. My everyday bike is a workhorse that I use to tow a trailer and get from a to b.

I also have started out as a bike mechanic so want to absorb as much information about these matters as I possibly can to be more informed for my customers who often ask these complicated questions. It's good to be able to say that I've asked around and done at least some straw poll research and found a rough conscensus.

 

[snailracer]

Then you might as well stick to something like a Shimano Alivio (budget mountain bike) chainset - all steel so no possibility of anodic corrosion between dissimilar materials, thick enough to take a bashing in the bike racks and square taper bottom bracket fitting which is still the most durable. AFAIK, Sora and even the Claris-level road bike chainsets have aluminium parts in them, so the risk of anodic corrosion remains.

 

[albion]

For my purposes --------------It's good to be able to say that I've asked around and done at least some straw poll research and found a rough conscensus.

Which you do not seem to be providing.

 

[fossyant]

Buy what you can afford, but remember some of the 'consumable' wear and tear parts are eye wateringly expensive, e.g. cassettes and chain rings ! There is nothing to stop you using a lower end cassette, especially if you are racking up big miles.

 

[vickster]

Sram Rival uses a lot of technology from RED, I see it as a good solid economy line without extra weight too much, but also bearing less features. So about 105 level, IMHO.

Good to hear

 

[DooDah]

I have latest iteration of 105 (unless it's been updated yet again without me knowing).

Before I bought my bike 1 year ago I tried Tiagra/105/Ultegra and in all honesty could not tell the difference - my wife says I am insensitive on occasion so maybe that's why.

Not keen on the sticky-up shifter cables on Tiagra tbh although in relation to planetary woes that's very small beer in reality.

They all work fine; flick lever and chain whizzes up and down the cogs and rings, pull lever and brakes go smoothly on, let it go and off they come - that's it really. Only the terminally obsessed and sad fret about the badges on the shiny doo-dahs.

Didn't realise I was shiny, thanks

 

[booze and cake]

Yep in my experience I'd agree with the 105 claims.

I have a singlespeed with no mudguards I got in 2008 that came with Sora. In less than a year the rear brake caliper seized as the spring bit just packed up, so when the lever was compressed the brakes went on and stayed on. I replaced it with a Tiagra and performance-wise they seemed the same but again within a year it seized along with the original front Sora. I then replaced both with a 105 an 3 and half years later they both still work perfectly.

I can't tell if the braking performance is any better but 105 seem to be made with stronger materials and/or components and lasts longer so represents the best value.

 

[Gravity Aided]

Didn't realise I was shiny, thanks

Perhaps only at the Holidays.

 

[Cyclopathic]

Which you do not seem to be providing.

Well, this is my point. This is exactly why I am asking the question. When I'm not fixing bikes I spend a lot of time reading about bikes and components and trying to find out as much as I can. I don't know everything but I am at least clear on the things I do know and those which I need to research more. This forum is a useful resource because of the sheer bredth of experience of the people here.

It is more than likely that there will not be a definitive answer to this question as their are many variables and also peoples requirements are individual. The purpose of asking the question is not to necessarily reach a single answer but to gauge the opinions of various riders and draw on their experiences so that when I'm talking to my customers I can give them the benefit of my own experience and that of other regular cyclists.

If you have found an LBS that does know everything and can give unerring advice in all circumstances to all of their customers, and came into the business with all that information ready formed in their minds without ever having to have asked anybody anything then I envy you and would like their number so that I can take my own bike to them.

 

[Globalti]

I've looked at the difference between a Tiagra and an Ultegra cassette. Tiagra has cogs that are made from pressed steel, a little ropey in appearance and all simple discs mounted on the cassette with spacers in between. Ultegra has the bigger cogs made of titanium, much better finished and riveted to an aluminium spider, so lighter and possibly more durable and udoubtedly more expensive to manufacture. As far as performance is concerned though I can't tell them apart.

On shifters, I think the old exposed cable Shimano shifters were far better because the route went straight around the shifter spindle and horizontally sideways out of the shifter body, heading inwards then curving gently back and running straight down the downtube, so the lever action was smooth and easy although long. The new hidden cable shifters are a retrograde design because the route is more convoluted, there's more friction and changing cables is difficult. However the cables are fashionably hidden and the lever action is fashionably shorter and snappier, though heavier.

 

[Dusty Bin]

I've looked at the difference between a Tiagra and an Ultegra cassette. Tiagra has cogs that are made from pressed steel, a little ropey in appearance and all simple discs mounted on the cassette with spacers in between. Ultegra has the bigger cogs made of titanium, much better finished and riveted to an aluminium spider, so lighter and possibly more durable and udoubtedly more expensive to manufacture. As far as performance is concerned though I can't tell them apart.

Ultegra doesn't have Ti sprockets, they are pressed steel like the rest of the range. Dura Ace does though...

 

[Mr Haematocrit]

it's only Dura-Ace which has Titanium sprockets although not the entire Cassette is, its only 16T and bigger

 

[snailracer]

it's only Dura-Ace which has Titanium sprockets although not the entire Cassette is, its only 16T and bigger

And titanium sprockets are less durable than steel ones.

Galvanic compatibility with steel/alu is iffy, too.