Ian H
Ancient randonneur
I have just acquired this, written by Richard - who built two of my bikes including the one shown earlier.
Well this is controversial
- Thread starter Venod
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I have just acquired this, written by Richard - who built two of my bikes including the one shown earlier.
Profpointy
Legendary Member
I must admit I was somewhat wary of CF for all the reasons that are regularly stated, particularly the supposed propensity for sudden rather than gradual failure. My otherwise traditional steel fixie came with a CF fork which is surely the most critical component of all. Now I'm used to it, I'd not worry about a whole bike of CF if it was otherwise suitable - and I think maybe only Hewitt do a sensible drop-handler light tourer / audax stylee bike with pannier rack and mudguards.
Apparently it's possible to engineer in whatever stiffness / springiness (even in different directions for the same part) with carbon, so there's a lot going for it quite apart from weight. Critical parts should be made very strong indeed, so there really shouldn't be an issue for a properly made bike. I'd maybe be less happy for a no-name import frame, though you can't really be sure a proper brand is sourcing them properly.
A tig welded steel, titanium or ali bike could well have poor welds, even if they look OK. Welding thin tubes is a tricky job. My 10 evening classes mig welding 3mm mild steel showed it's not trivial using a more forgiving process on the easier to weld thicker material
I'm guessing it'd be be harder to do a bad braze (that still looked OK), unless you'd deliberately hidden a too short tube
Apparently it's possible to engineer in whatever stiffness / springiness (even in different directions for the same part) with carbon, so there's a lot going for it quite apart from weight. Critical parts should be made very strong indeed, so there really shouldn't be an issue for a properly made bike. I'd maybe be less happy for a no-name import frame, though you can't really be sure a proper brand is sourcing them properly.
A tig welded steel, titanium or ali bike could well have poor welds, even if they look OK. Welding thin tubes is a tricky job. My 10 evening classes mig welding 3mm mild steel showed it's not trivial using a more forgiving process on the easier to weld thicker material
I'm guessing it'd be be harder to do a bad braze (that still looked OK), unless you'd deliberately hidden a too short tube
AndyRM
XOXO
- Location
- North Shields
Been meaning to get involved with that, thanks for the reminder!
Read that a while ago; lots of entirely valid points IMO and aligns very much with my own thoughts.
Indeed.. aircraft that are subject to far, far greater R&D budgets than consumer sporting goods. Aircraft that are subject to far higher levels of quality control during manufacture, and ongoing, rigerous testing and inspection regimes.But they make jet aircraft out of it so checkmate
I don't think that's fair - just because it doesn't fall neatly into the perception constantly up-sold to us by manufacturers, doesn't make it the intentional, baseless, sensational clickbait you seem to be suggesting.
Poor welds are a lot easier to spot however
Dogtrousers
Kilometre nibbler
Meh. On balance he's probably right a bit more often than he's wrong, but he's just opinionated and neither right nor wrong a lot of the time. It's not new or interesting.
And he doesn't raise the point that @matticus mentioned, which is pretty important - that CF is not recyclable.
And he doesn't raise the point that @matticus mentioned, which is pretty important - that CF is not recyclable.
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Airborne,Van Nic bikes 18 and 17 years old ..Light and strong and the other plus points no paint to scatch and no rust. Now tell me the plus points of the rust buckets 😂
Back them everyone said if going custom its got to be steel how wrong they were.
Now this
Only buy Carbon if it's been built correctly in a factory with excellent quality control.
Back them everyone said if going custom its got to be steel how wrong they were.
Now this
Only buy Carbon if it's been built correctly in a factory with excellent quality control.
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Carbon fibre production increases each year what to do with the stuff that's left after manufacturing.
https://www.compositesworld.com/articles/the-state-of-recycled-carbon-fiber
https://www.compositesworld.com/articles/the-state-of-recycled-carbon-fiber
fossyant
Ride It Like You Stole It!
- Location
- South Manchester
Snappy, oops sorry, cracky titanium ! Youngsters at 17 and 18. My 3 rust buckets are about 30-34 years old !
Mr Celine
Discordian
- Location
- Waxing my moustache
The only thing I've gleaned from that bit of click bait is that the author has never ridden his bike on Scottish winter roads.
notmyrealnamebutclose
Senior Member
notmyrealnamebutclose
Senior Member
Made me laugh but wasn't that a submersible ? Submarines can mostly dive to a depth of less than a 1000 metres
Time Waster
Veteran
I have two steel bikes, a rust free, 34 year old steel road bike that didn't see much rain. The second is a Brompton that started rusting at about 6 months, a few bolts even earlier! I don't think either are a good example of steel is real argument. My aluminium with cf fork is about 10 years old and doing well despite a few bits of damage to it
I think if you buy a good bike in any suitable materials should be good enough. CF isn't that hard to design in, it's not the case that a bike firm and manufacturers needing design budget of a plane. There's software that makes it a relatively easy to design the CF layup once you have the 3D model for the bike. It's all about the fibre direction in the layers I believe. The characteristics of CF has been well tested and understood.
When I studied it something like 30 years ago it was at least. Then again the bigger or more complex bthe CF part is then the actual layup to design is harder. It was 35 years or so ago mi saw a full delta wing in CF for a euro fighter prototype that had too many faults to make it into a plane. It was huge and very complex much more so than a bike frame or forks.
Too much bias all round I reckon on this topic.
I think if you buy a good bike in any suitable materials should be good enough. CF isn't that hard to design in, it's not the case that a bike firm and manufacturers needing design budget of a plane. There's software that makes it a relatively easy to design the CF layup once you have the 3D model for the bike. It's all about the fibre direction in the layers I believe. The characteristics of CF has been well tested and understood.
When I studied it something like 30 years ago it was at least. Then again the bigger or more complex bthe CF part is then the actual layup to design is harder. It was 35 years or so ago mi saw a full delta wing in CF for a euro fighter prototype that had too many faults to make it into a plane. It was huge and very complex much more so than a bike frame or forks.
Too much bias all round I reckon on this topic.
ColinJ
Puzzle game procrastinator!
- Location
- Todmorden - Yorks/Lancs border
My Cannondale CAAD5 (red bike in avatar) is nearly 22 now, and has been great. For half that time I was riding it when I weighed 20-30+ kg (3-5 stone) more than I do now!
D
Deleted member 121159
Guest
My reason for sticking with metals is that 'carbon' is a shorthand for carbon fibre reinforced plastic. In other words, once you're done with it, it's plastic crap like any other plastic crap. I don't want to be a consumer of yet another form of plastic crap. There's enough plastic crap in my life.
What I'd love to see is more premium aluminium frames, like Nicolai for example.
What I'd love to see is more premium aluminium frames, like Nicolai for example.
