Want to ride like a pro? Concentrate on watts, not weight

[Rob3rt]

Looks like this equates to 5 hard sessions a week given that the two races you would presumably count as additional threshold sessions. If that is the case how did you prevent burnout?

By not being a big jessy!

 

[50000tears]

By not being a big jessy!

I do wonder how much is due to you doing so much turbo work. I find that when I do turbo intervals they are the hard as hell to get through and burying yourself is certainly the name of the game, but they do not seem to generate the same leg fatigue as a longer but less intense road session would. The day after a turbo session I can very often go to the well again, but 2-3 hours on the road and I tend to need more recovery to feel sharp again.

 

[Rob3rt]

I do wonder how much is due to you doing so much turbo work. I find that when I do turbo intervals they are the hard as hell to get through and burying yourself is certainly the name of the game, but they do not seem to generate the same leg fatigue as a longer but less intense road session would. The day after a turbo session I can very often go to the well again, but 2-3 hours on the road and I tend to need more recovery to feel sharp again.

I would say your experience is not typical. If one was to generate 100 TSS by training hard on the turbo(or road) in 90 minutes, you would expect the resulting fatigue to be greater than if you were to take 3 hours to generate the same TSS, i.e. lower intensity factor.

 

[ColinJ]

I do wonder how much is due to you doing so much turbo work. I find that when I do turbo intervals they are the hard as hell to get through and burying yourself is certainly the name of the game, but they do not seem to generate the same leg fatigue as a longer but less intense road session would. The day after a turbo session I can very often go to the well again, but 2-3 hours on the road and I tend to need more recovery to feel sharp again.

You are not trying hard enough on the turbo then! When I did my 'winter of pain' on the turbo, I couldn't walk upstairs after a session. I would sometimes lose 2-3 kgs in 90 minutes, implying that I was sweating out about a litre every 30 minutes.

 

[jdtate101]

I wonder does a few lbs really make much difference? If you use the online calculators it suggests not. Of course if you're a hill climb competitor, then a second here or there really counts. But I still have the feeling that most cyclists (not the "well trained" ones") could gain most speed by focusing on improving Watts rather than reducing Lbs. Both is best of course, but I am talking about focus.

http://www.analyticcycling.com/ForcesSpeed_Page.html

I some respects, yes. Probably more cyclists could make gains from increased cardio base rather than just pure power. Round where I live there is hardly any flat and weight is a large part of keeping pace in a group, the larger lads find it tough going on rolling courses as they have to expend much more energy whenever the road goes up.
Skinny or muscly, I know which I'd rather be on the bike... (which is why I'm currently on a plan to reduce my weight to 75kg). I've yoyo'd between 86kg and 80kg and whilst my avg pwr has remained roughly constant, I can notice the difference the weight makes in avg speed.

 

[50000tears]

I would say your experience is not typical. If one was to generate 100 TSS by training hard on the turbo(or road) in 90 minutes, you would expect the resulting fatigue to be greater than if you were to take 3 hours to generate the same TSS, i.e. lower intensity factor.

I should have qualified to point out that I was not comparing a 1 hour turbo session to a 3 hour easy ride but to a tempo+ type of ride over a lumpy course. Which the only type around my way.

Even so your point is taken, as is Colin's, as I have never done an interval session so hard that I couldn't even climb a few steps! Despite that I cannot see how I could make my intervals much tougher as they are already brutal enough.

 

[Rob3rt]

You are not equating like for like, which is where you are going wrong I think.

 

[50000tears]

You are not equating like for like, which is where you are going wrong I think.

No arguments from me on that one. I know a little about TSS scores but not nearly enough to be able to work them out.

 

[poynedexter]

last year i dropped my weight down to about 9st 8lbs in dec from 10st 4lbs in aug. i trained away and come race time i sucked. i realised that i had lost some power and paid the price in top speed. so i changed my diet, gained all the weight back and kept training. my results improved and i enjoyed my racing!
this year the focus is on training and quality nutrition, not losing a few pounds. with the style of courses we ride here in n.i, its about power first, then endurance.

i think if you need to shift a LOT of weight in fat, then do it, but if you are fairly slim, focus on hard training, not calories. those last few lbs arent the problem, imho. however, i can feel the fat slipping away as my jeans are getting loose, but the scales dont show much, and that, i'm pleased with.

 

[ColinJ]

I take your original point @nickyboy, but having met you back in May, I would say that you are still built more like a chunky rugby player than your typical cyclist. That's not a bad thing unless you want to go uphill faster on your bike, but you do, so I reckon you should consider losing a stone or two. In your case, quite a lot of that would be upper body muscle rather than fat, but those muscles aren't going to be doing much for your cycling.

 

[nickyboy]

I take your original point @nickyboy, but having met you back in May, I would say that you are still built more like a chunky rugby player than your typical cyclist. That's not a bad thing unless you want to go uphill faster on your bike, but you do, so I reckon you should consider losing a stone or two. In your case, quite a lot of that would be upper body muscle rather than fat, but those muscles aren't going to be doing much for your cycling.

I've been that chunky rugby player build since I was about 15 and weigh about the same as I did twenty odd years ago. I wouldn't know how to get rid of some of the muscle mass, although I would love to do so to help my climbing. I don't do any exercise to maintain the upper body muscles at all. I've done thousands of miles on the bike over the past 2-3 years but I stay exactly the same shape. Bit frustrating really.

 

[ColinJ]

I've been that chunky rugby player build since I was about 15 and weigh about the same as I did twenty odd years ago. I wouldn't know how to get rid of some of the muscle mass, although I would love to do so to help my climbing. I don't do any exercise to maintain the upper body muscles at all. I've done thousands of miles on the bike over the past 2-3 years but I stay exactly the same shape. Bit frustrating really.

Wow - I assumed that you lived in the gym!

I have been telling people for years that I am not naturally a big build but they didn't believe me but now that I have lost a lot of weight they can see that I am actually more of a medium build. I am scrawny at 11 st 7 lbs and start to look fat above 13 st 7 lbs. The last time I was 11 st 7 lbs, I could climb a lot better on the bike, but I felt a bit weedy. Just under 12 st will do me, and any climbing improvements after that will have to come from increased power.

I would have to do an awful lot of work to develop big muscles. I noticed today that my legs are getting slimmer as they get stronger - they have lost more fat bulk then they gained in muscle bulk.

 

[cyberknight]

he may be just lighter stronger and younger than most of us ......little git

Bet he aint lumping steel about all night then trying to ride home on pitch black roads dodging badgers either .