Vintage Holdsworth - can you help ??

[Rimmer]

So it's not really possible to tell the model without the BB frame number (anyone want to guess?) - hopefully, that's not been sprayed over and still legible.

I get the feeling that there is also a chance this is not a Holdsworth - the frame may not be a 531 either (could just be a badge). Also what condition is the frame in under the paint.

I think if I knew the model I would get it re-sprayed (again) in the right colour for authenticity.

 

[rogerzilla]

Head badge, drop outs, chainset, brakes, and fork crown. Could be 70's. We've got some experts on here - I only really know 85 onwards as had a period Raleigh 531c and own two early 90's steel bikes - this is a fair bit older and also the freewheel, looks like the rear axel is 126mm, as from around 85-86 130mm was the new standard, which has remained.

More like mid-90s, when mid-market bikes went to 8 speed.

 

[fossyant]

More like mid-90s, when mid-market bikes went to 8 speed.

Pah, I had 8 speed the minute it came out.



Dura Ace, cost a fortune. I was young, worked and lived at home, and was loaded on £5k a year !

 

[Drago]

Id go with late 70's, more likely early 80's. Very similar frame and kit to the Claud Butler Sierra of that era, which was made on the same workbench.

Likely to have had a Suntour VX or VX-GT rear mech when new. Those look like Wolber rims, and along with the chainset would be in the 82-83 age range. I don't think the brake calipers are original.

Lack of brazed cable guides on the top tube do indeed mark it as a more mundane model. It almost certainly is 531 beyond any reasonable doubt, but most likely only 531 main tubes and fork blades, but still probably a nice riding machine for all that.

As Mr Lops rightly points out it has been refinished, but likely not by a pro cycle painter as the wrong 'renovated' decal has been used for the age of the bike. A professional who is authorised to use Reynolds decals would know to use one age appropriate to the bike.

Not worth super high money, but very well respected as really good machines to ride and do go for middling sums. Id have thought 60 sheets a steal, and in original trim in good order could go as high as £150-£200ish.

Id be inclined to buy it, sort it out, fit proper bars, and enjoy it as a lovely riding machine at cheap money rather than any thoughts of investment potential, although once its sorted the value will only ever one way.

 

[Rimmer]

Id go with late 70's, more likely early 80's. Very similar frame and kit to the Claud Butler Sierra of that era, which was made on the same workbench.

Likely to have had a Suntour VX or VX-GT rear mech when new. Those look like Wolber rims, and along with the chainset would be in the 82-83 age range. I don't think the brake calipers are original.

Lack of brazed cable guides on the top tube do indeed mark it as a more mundane model. It almost certainly is 531 beyond any reasonable doubt, but most likely only 531 main tubes and fork blades, but still probably a nice riding machine for all that.

As Mr Lops rightly points out it has been refinished, but likely not by a pro cycle painter as the wrong 'renovated' decal has been used for the age of the bike. A professional who is authorised to use Reynolds decals would know to use one age appropriate to the bike.

Not worth super high money, but very well respected as really good machines to ride and do go for middling sums. Id have thought 60 sheets a steal, and in original trim in good order could go as high as £150-£200ish.

Id be inclined to buy it, sort it out, fit proper bars, and enjoy it as a lovely riding machine at cheap money rather than any thoughts of investment potential, although once its sorted the value will only ever one way.

I’ve have the BB number - it is 2272

 

[midlife]

I'll check the frame number on Retrobike's list. As mentioned, Holdsworth went under BB cable guides early and my bet it's late 70's

 

[T4tomo]

I’ve have the BB number - it is 2272

if it doesn't have 2 preceding zero's, then that doesn't fit with 70's
http://nkilgariff.com/Images/Holdsworth_Frame_Numbers.JPG

 

[Drago]

Bear in mind that records are imcomplete, and the Holdsworth/Claud/Freddie Grubb numbering systems would change, often without record, and then change back again.

That said, its without doubt from the late 70's - early 80's era, and if the wheels are original (they're certainly Holdsworth/CB wheels) that narrows it further, so it should be a 6 digit frame number beginning 00, 03 or 04. But...the provisos apply about gaps in the numbering systms, and some frames having sat "on the shelf" for years for unknown reasons before being painted up and made into a bike for sale. That being the case you're never going to know the age of the frame to a high degree of confidence.

The wheels appear original, it might be possible to see a date code on the hubs. Ditto the cralpnks, liable to habe a date code embossed on the rear. Those are likely to be the best indicators of the bikes age.

 

[Rimmer]

Bear in mind that records are imcomplete, and the Holdsworth/Claud/Freddie Grubb numbering systems would change, often without record, and then change back again.

That said, its without doubt from the late 70's - early 80's era, and if the wheels are original (they're certainly Holdsworth/CB wheels) that narrows it further, so it should be a 6 digit frame number beginning 00, 03 or 04. But...the provisos apply about gaps in the numbering systms, and some frames having sat "on the shelf" for years for unknown reasons before being painted up and made into a bike for sale. That being the case you're never going to know the age of the frame to a high degree of confidence.

The wheels appear original, it might be possible to see a date code on the hubs. Ditto the cralpnks, liable to habe a date code embossed on the rear. Those are likely to be the best indicators of the bikes age.

Oh heck - I may have to return and see if I can find more numbers elsewhere. Below is a photo I took of the BB - you can just about see the number - it's very hard to see ... hopefully the photo is clear enough because some of you might know the correct format (font, size etc) of the number:

 

[Rimmer]

Probably not relevant but here are some more close ups too...

 

[T4tomo]

Here a 2 to compare
Could be special build frame number from 70s

 

[Drago]

Although a special build frame without to tube cable guides would be an oddity. Why go to that effort to built a lower end of the range frame?

 

[Rimmer]

It looks like the first two digits are covered in grime and therefore only the last four digits are visible - certainly that would make sense to me.

 

[Rimmer]

Back I go with a can of WD40 and a cloth so I can clear off the rest of the grime :|

So anything at the front starting 00 means 70's (either early or late)

 

[T4tomo]

Back I go with a can of WD40 and a cloth so I can clear off the rest of the grime :|

So anything at the front starting 00 means 70's (either early or late)

nearly, either 5 or 6 digits - look at link in post #22 lower left hand side cover s70's onwards Holdsworth. switch from 5 to 6 digit in 76. its a guide, not gospel, and relates to frame being produced dates, not sold dates. The could be made up and sold in a later year, so sometime a frame number doesn't match that years catalogue pictures decals etc. although as yours is a respray, decal become irrelevant

Also often they were sold as just a frame with components being added by end user or a bike shop intermediary, so just because catalogue says just comes with Campag nuovo record kit if sold as a complete bike direct from factory, it could well have been supplied with Suntour or Shimano kit by via a bike shop.