Updating an old bike

[RecordAceFromNew]

I'd be surprised if you couldn't spring the rear triangle to accept a 130mm hub. I have read the link from @RecordAceFromNew , but 2mm either side really isn't a lot. It may be worth borrowing a 130mm hub and seeing how easily (or not) it will slot in.

As you know I did not say it can't be cold set (or bent), but that it shouldn't be. I have heard many anecdotal comments on the foolhardiness of doing that to such a paper-thin walled, specially treated, classic frame. An example comment from this parish is here attributed to no less than Brian Rourke and Bob Jackson. Further if you look at Reynold's 753 tech doc (attached below) in relation to Frame Building it clearly says "setting must be avoided". I would never stop anybody doing whatever they wish to their own frame, but I will never suggest that they should ignore such clear warnings.

I have measured the dropouts and they definitely are 126mm. I am not at all sure what to do now, I don't want to spend too much on wheels and hubs. The A410 from CRC might be a compromise, I don't mind if I had to clean and repack the bearings. I suppose a complete wheel that will fit straight on is going to be hard to find?

Regarding the question of how to acquire a quality new 126mm rear wheel, if it was me I would avoid looking at any screw-on / freewheel option not only because quality is scarce there but freewheels are never light and always limiting, and obviously also no UG for reason I gave previously. That leaves other 6/7 speed freehubs, which would nearly inevitably be a Shimano HG not only because of availability, but because of the choice of available transplant hub/wheel target.

So I would probably buy one of these hoping it is better, or despite my experience mentioned earlier given the low price scavenge one from CRC's A410 hub offering, and put it on a wheel with a Shimano rear hub that has the same freehub/hub interface. I think hub choice is good, and should include every road wheel with modern sora, tiagra as well as 105 hub. Not only that, I am pretty sure even some current Shimano factory wheels such as the WH-R550 e.g. have compatible hubs. But do come back with the model code of the hub (it is usually FHxxxx or WHxxx) and check before committing to buy, just in case.

While just swapping the freehub from 8/9/10 speed should give you nearly the correct width reduction (with probably +/- 1mm or so of difference which can easily be addressed by spacer/locknut replacement), unfortunately the wheel will also have to be redished, by a couple of mm, because swapping the freehub is going to take width away from the drive side only - it is for this reason that you might want to avoid buying a factory wheel, not that redishing can't be done, but it is a little trickier because of their typically low spoke count and high spoke tension.

Finally Shimano threaded QR hollow axles protrude 5.5mm beyond the locknuts on each side. The extra 4mm from a 130mm hub could either be shared by spacing if the width of the dropouts allow or simply sawn off.

If the above sounds daunting, I am sure a decent wheel builder should have no problem doing all the fiddling, for perhaps no more than £20.

Just my 2p.

 

[DaveyA]

Thanks so much for the detailed information. It has been really helpful. I'm afraid that my knowledge of modern components is lacking somewhat. The last time I carried out any mods to my bike was when aero brake levers and index gear changers came onto the scene, that will give you some idea of how long ago that was.
So just to make sure I have understood correctly. In any case, I am going to need a 6/7 speed HP (hyperglide?) freehub. Any Shimano hub that is compatible with the freehub. Some rims/spokes etc and the services of a wheel builder to assemble and set the dish and final axle width to suit my dropouts.
Thank you for your patience. I think an up to date guide to cycle maintenance should have been on my Christmas list.
Happy New Year to all.
Dave

 

[DaveyA]

Would these do the job?

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Shimano-f...sure_cycling_bikeparts_SR&hash=item2ecd1c81ea

 

[alicat]

If it ain't broke don't fix it.

Personally I would ride it a bit before deciding what to do with it. You may find it like it just as it is or conversely that you don't like it at all and no amount of upgrading it will sort it out to your satisfaction.

Upgrading old bikes can turn out to be surprising expensive for the resultant improvement.

Ask yourself (and tell us) why you stopped riding it in the first place and that may give you the answers you need.

Good luck!

 

[RecordAceFromNew]

Would these do the job?

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Shimano-f...sure_cycling_bikeparts_SR&hash=item2ecd1c81ea

If the rear hub internals are the same (sometimes they do change slightly over time) as depicted here, then all you need to get the right spacing is to remove the 2 x 2mm spacers (item 15) from each side of the axle. The only other thing you should check is to see if your frame dropouts are no less than 7.5mm thick (if you are to keep the 141mm axle unchanged). That freehub won't accept a 11T sprocket so only cassette from 12T.

If you stick with downtube shifters then you can having 8/9 speed on a 7 speed HG hub if you get a 9/10 speed cassette (and corresponding chain) with individual loose/pinned/riveted sprockets, which is usually the case for those from the lower/cheaper groups. It will also give you more cassette options.

Obviously there is no point replacing your existing hub/wheel if they work or are serviceable. I have a 531 also bought from new in the 80's, so I can understand why you would want to keep yours going and riding it.

 

[DaveyA]

The only reason I stopped riding the bike is that I drifted away from serious cycling and did other things, running, rowing, drinking. But now I want to do more cycling as I can feel that the running is starting to take its toll. A couple of months ago I bought myself a Kona Jake The Snake and just love it. Its a great all round bike, nice and light enough for road riding but where I can avoid traffic I will hop straight onto the trails etc.
I would just like to get the Gazelle out now and again when the better weather comes, it is an old friend and I have put many miles in on it, albeit around 25 years ago. After riding JTS with its lower gearing, 36/46 and 11-28, I don't think I will be comfortable churning a 42/52 again. So all I want to do is try and have similar gearing on both bikes, something kinder on the legs. It won't be getting any hard use, just an occasional outing now and again for a change and for old times sake.
7 speeds and a 12T sprocket would be enough for me. I don't intend changing anything else and will keep everything as it is now, downtube shifters, brakes etc. I would like some new rims on the new hubs as I have no idea now how many miles my old ones have done. I have seen one of my rims explode many years ago because it was worn through. Luckily I had arrived at work by then and parked the bike in the corner of the garage, soon afterwards there was a bit of a pop and the bike fell over! So I tend to worry about things like that now. Which begs another question if thats ok. This bike is around 25 years old now and whilst there is only the tiniest bit of corrosion where the paint has chipped off one of the fork ends its anybody's guess as to the condition of the tubes inside. I always had another "winter" bike so it has never been used on salted roads. It is rather hilly around where I live and the thought of a section of frame parting company with another at speed is a concern. How much confidence should I have in it? I did say I was a worrier
Thanks again.

 

[DaveyA]

I am about to order a Stronglight compact that RecordAce pointed me to. I was going to order a new BB at the same time. Would my frame be Italian or English thread? It has Cinelli engraved into the frame lug where the BB threads are. Hoping its not Italian because they seem to be out of stock.

 

[RecordAceFromNew]

Would my frame be Italian or English thread? It has Cinelli engraved into the frame lug where the BB threads are. Hoping its not Italian because they seem to be out of stock.

If the shell width is 70mm it is likely Italian (BSA is 68mm). For 107mm JIS 70mm you can get one of these but if I were you I would pick the one here instead.

 

[Amanda P]

I'm no expert but.... I'd be amazed if any steel frame couldn't absorb 4mm of hub width. I'm not talking about cold-setting the frame to 130mm, just gently springing the stays out to take a 130mm hub.

If that still seems too much, look carefully at the hubs you want to use. Often spacers, washers and locknuts can be removed, replaced with thinner ones or just filed down a bit to reduce OLN width, especially on the non-drive side. If you're buidling a wheel from scratch, it's easy enough to get the rim centred on the re-spaced hub, and if you're using a complete wheel, it's unlikely that you wouldn't be able to re-centre the rim without replacing the spokes - we're only talking of 4mm max.

 

[DaveyA]

Thanks once again for the help.
I have borrowed the tool to remove the bottom bracket and I will give it a go tomorrow. Fingers crossed that it comes out ok, its been in there a long time. I will measure the width then.
If the BB job goes alright I think I might borrow a 130mm hub/wheel and gently try the fit on my bike. Actually, when I open the QR on my wheel the stays do spring apart slightly so it is a generous 126mm gap.