Unemployment - Transport - Cycling

[HMS_Dave]

As someone who was very obese, i would not even be remotely tempted by the offer of some sort of drug. No judgement on anybody else who might want it but for me, your life needs reworking from top to bottom to really beat obesity in a modern western society and not some quick fix jab that you will have to keep having... This situation is caused by a variety of reasons. We could talk endlessly about laziness or whatever but the fact is, society is changed. The access to easy food is among us. Coupled with a flexible work schedule and often many hours and it is all too easy to pick up the phone, or click an app and have stuff delivered. Most not good foods. Food delivery services are booming and in my opinion, is not good at all... With so many around it, all fighting for your business with psychologically studied and targeted ads designed to get you buying, it is a totally uphill battle for anybody with a food addiction...

As someone who has been on both sides of the fence, As always, The Government seem to be targeting the "users" and not the "pushers" and this is not the route to any sort of meaningful change for the better and is more likely a scheme to make it seem like they're doing something hard line on the matter when in reality it will do nothing...

Happy to revisit this in years to come to see how it works out.

 

[blackrat]

I know there will be some medical cases where such a tretment might be appropriate, but for the clear majority I cant help thinking it would be more cost efficient and healthier to promote eating less and exercising more.

Very true, far too many lazy folks.

 

[annedonnelly]

I see anti-obesity drugs are to be prescribed to those out of work, in order to encourage them into work - on a trial basis.
I also think that transport can be a real problem, when it comes to taking on potential work. Especially with the mindset people have around car dependency.

I'm wondering if loaning (or even giving) people bikes, locks, helmets and lights when they receive local offers of employment would be feasible, and beneficial to society as a whole.

We already have social prescribing of exercise in some areas, including cycling and loan bikes.

Sharing for comment on the feasibility/practicality - not the political aspects.

That used to offered here in Northumberland. There were loan bikes, and finance towards motorbikes/motorscooters. A few years ago now and I don't know what the take-up was or whether it's still available. There is still free cycling training via the County Council.

When the new rail line opens here (scheduled for December) the fare for under 18s has been capped at a very low price (around £1.50 I think) which should help youngsters access job opportunities in and around Newcastle.

 

[mjr]

What proportion of the long-term unemployed have access to a car?
My thinking was more around opening opportunities to people that don't currently have them.

And of course, this precludes the people who are long-term unemployed either due to long term health problems or a long wait for treatment.

The data may be out there but not neatly cross-referenced in a public way. We can see if it looks likely by comparing:
1. no adults without health problems in employment % of household by area:

2. no access to car % of households by area:

I don't think that looks all that strongly correlated. Do you?

I suspect that car availability is much more strongly correlated to proximity to work, school and public transport hubs. If you live near those, you don't need to spend on a car. Out of town, where government has allowed the public transport system to fail pretty much, and hasn't yet provided decent cycling links (on the above map, there's no good way across the bypasses and those out across the river to the west are mediocre and short: the finger south is an artefact from that LSOA including the southern edge of town), more will pay for cars.

I think in Norwich, you can see a distance effect distorted slightly by the university area to the west, the cycle route network arms and the high-frequency bus corridors:

 

[mjr]

Not sure what's up here. Here are the maps again:

(blue and purple are cycle routes, red are bus routes)

 

[mjr]

Give folks a bike and it'll go in the shed never to see the light of day. Nice idea but only for those who can be arsed to go out in all weathers. I wish I had more faith in humanity but I don't.

How can we have any faith in humanity when even cyclists perpetuate myths that cycling is difficult, pretend warm coats and waterproofs don't exist?

even me, a crazy cyclist, thought about jacking it in when it got cold and increasingly wet.

Yep, really crazy that, not using the right clothing for the conditions.

You also wont get more people cycling, Its hard going and there's problems everywhere with ignorant drivers and with the cycle lanes being blocked etc. People not used to all this just wont be able to cope with it.

Disagree about the hard going (except for headwinds and e-bikes might help with that) but there are a lot of problems. If this government gets serious about fining the balls off drivers who close-pass, block cycle lanes and so on, would they cope with it? If they force councils and Nationaal Highways to fix junctions and make them all look like drawings from the Cycle Infra Design manual within 10 years, would that help?

 

[HLaB]

I see anti-obesity drugs are to be prescribed to those out of work, in order to encourage them into work - on a trial basis.
I also think that transport can be a real problem, when it comes to taking on potential work. Especially with the mindset people have around car dependency.

I'm wondering if loaning (or even giving) people bikes, locks, helmets and lights when they receive local offers of employment would be feasible, and beneficial to society as a whole.

We already have social prescribing of exercise in some areas, including cycling and loan bikes.

Sharing for comment on the feasibility/practicality - not the political aspects.

My colleague was at a course on that subject last week and some areas are already doing giving away bikes to those who can't afford them apparently.

 

[matticus]

I also think that transport can be a real problem, when it comes to taking on potential work. Especially with the mindset people have around car dependency.

I'm wondering if loaning (or even giving) people bikes, locks, helmets and lights when they receive local offers of employment would be feasible, and beneficial to society as a whole.

I think we've heard this idea before! https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Norman_Tebbit

 

[mjr]

I think we've heard this idea before! https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Norman_Tebbit

I don't think Tebbit suggested stabbing them in the belly.

Or at least not with drugs. 😉

 

[Kingfisher101]

How can we have any faith in humanity when even cyclists perpetuate myths that cycling is difficult, pretend warm coats and waterproofs don't exist?

Yep, really crazy that, not using the right clothing for the conditions.


Disagree about the hard going (except for headwinds and e-bikes might help with that) but there are a lot of problems. If this government gets serious about fining the balls off drivers who close-pass, block cycle lanes and so on, would they cope with it? If they force councils and Nationaal Highways to fix junctions and make them all look like drawings from the Cycle Infra Design manual within 10 years, would that help?

I think it is hard going in the winter commuting in the very bad weather. I've never had a car and always had bikes so I do have experience of this. Its not like riding in the South of France in the summer here in the U.K.
It's really bad in the winter, getting soaked and splashed with puddles etc, in the pitch black and freezing cold. Waterproofs are not even that waterproof and have you ever worn the trousers LOL. I've cycled in the hail, blizzards, pxxx ing rain you name and its horrible.
The Government and councils will never do anything about the bike lanes being blocked by drivers. If they were serious about doing something they would have done it by now. The whole thing is an absolute joke.

 

[blackrat]

My colleague was at a course on that subject last week and some areas are already doing giving away bikes to those who can't afford them apparently.

The tax payer paid for this give-a-way and they'll just be sold on.

 

[Punkawallah]

Had a chap in my FLBS asking about a bike for commuting. Had been told by the DWP (?) they would fund his bike purchase if the bike was second hand. Don’t know any other details, or how wide spread this is.

 

[TomDW]

You can lead a horse to water but it doesn't mean it'll drink. Give folks a bike and it'll go in the shed never to see the light of day. Nice idea but only for those who can be arsed to go out in all weathers. I wish I had more faith in humanity but I don't. I rode my bike to work for 35 years and even me, a crazy cyclist, thought about jacking it in when it got cold and increasingly wet.

I used to joke with friends that you could pay people to commute by bike but they'd still drive.

 

[mjr]

It's really bad in the winter, getting soaked and splashed with puddles etc, in the pitch black and freezing cold. Waterproofs are not even that waterproof and have you ever worn the trousers LOL. I've cycled in the hail, blizzards, pxxx ing rain you name and its horrible.

Yes, I've worn the trousers. My waterproofs are good enough for a few hours, fine for most transport, but if it's not too windy, I do prefer a cape/poncho which means I don't have to bother with the trousers* and it does give more protection against hail, which is one of the few things which will cause me to stop riding and hunker down if wearing coat not cape.

* - but I do then have to time passing the deep puddles that drivers splash over a substandard cycleway, but that's more of a problem of crap road design than the waterproofs.

Lights and coats have both improved massively since I started cycling. There's not really any reason to be riding in the pitch black or to be cold, unless you get caught out by delays or the weather changing when you haven't taken the right clothes.

It's pretty nice in winter on the good days, but the rainy ones are rarely the most fun until it stops raining or you get to your destination.

The Government and councils will never do anything about the bike lanes being blocked by drivers. If they were serious about doing something they would have done it by now. The whole thing is an absolute joke.

One problem is that cyclists are too mild and too defeatist. Let's take a page out of the book of those motorists who blow up traffic control cameras, but instead take it out on motorists. If we set fire to a few of the cars blocking bike lanes, or started tipping them into the carriageway, government would soon get serious, although we'd probably be locked up before long and unable to enjoy the results.

 

[mjr]

I used to joke with friends that you could pay people to commute by bike but they'd still drive.

Didn't some Italian city pay people to bike to work? Maybe Bologna. Anyone know how it went?