UK SUV Petition

[icowden]

That are somewhat Laissez-faire when it comes to protecting vulnerable road users.

An example please?

 

[Rusty Nails]

An example please?

Any SUV (or car, van, people carrier) with a high flattish front and/or high bumpers.

http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=...usg=AOvVaw1baMjX1lzv9N5n1K-1_Xhw&opi=89978449

 

[icowden]

Any SUV (or car, van, people carrier) with a high flattish front and/or high bumpers.

http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=&ved=2ahUKEwi47YP-i5WEAxVYXUEAHW6FDhEQFnoECA0QAw&url=http://www.tara.tcd.ie/bitstream/handle/2262/41169/Pedestrian%20risk%20from%20cars.pdf&usg=AOvVaw1baMjX1lzv9N5n1K-1_Xhw&opi=89978449

That study seems to demonstrate the reverse argument? It finds that head injuries from SUVs are lower but body injuries substantially higher. It also finds that EU directives to improve safety for EuroNCAP have resulted in more curved bonnets with lower primary impact location and removal of additional hazards such as bull bars.

The Parliamentary Advisory Council for Transport Safety has called for the Govt to align with EU rules on Pedestrian safety including the General and Pedestrian Safety Regulations - a package of 15 measures to improve safety (many of which were UK led).

Hardly seems laissez faire to have the EU actively working to improve pedestrian safety from vehicles does it?

See also Regulation 78/2009 on the type-approval of motor vehicles with regard to the protection of pedestrians and other vulnerable road users which has applied since 2009
https://eur-lex.europa.eu/EN/legal-...of-pedestrians-and-vulnerable-road-users.html

 

[Dogtrousers]

I'd have a test for minibuses and vans too. It's bonkers that I can drive a 7.5 tonne furniture lorry with no additional training or experience.

Babk in the early 80s I was working in a shop and had just passed my test. I was therefore qualified to drive the delivery vans. I had a go in the big one (no idea what it was but it was a big square thing - bigger than a transit). It was too much for me at the time so I asked not to drive that, but they would have been happy to let me. As things turned out I used to do deliveries in the other "van" .... a Mini traveller.

 

[Dogtrousers]

It wasn't unheard of for us to catch a burglar and for them to complain that we weren't out harassing motorists and keeping the roads safe.

Every class of criminal has some excuse as to why they think the police should be hassling a different class of law breaker.

I have gathered you together in ze drawing room tonight because one of you is ze murderer... Eet was you, Lord Farquarson!

Blast you Poirot, you interfering Belgian! Why aren't you doing something useful like catching shoplifters in Holland and Barrett in Accrington?

 

[Drago]

Babk in the early 80s I was working in a shop and had just passed my test. I was therefore qualified to drive the delivery vans. I had a go in the big one (no idea what it was but it was a big square thing - bigger than a transit). It was too much for me at the time so I asked not to drive that, but they would have been happy to let me. As things turned out I used to do deliveries in the other "van" .... a Mini traveller.

The road traffic act used to have a clause that permitted coppers to drive pretty much anything for the purposes of clearing a highway, irrespective of rhe vehicle entitlement on their licences. I've driven artics, buses, coaches, cranes, all sorts. Only a few dozen yards, mind.

 

[Fab Foodie]

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2024/feb/06/paris-suvs-uk-parisians-triple-parking-charges

 

[Rusty Nails]

That study seems to demonstrate the reverse argument? It finds that head injuries from SUVs are lower but body injuries substantially higher. It also finds that EU directives to improve safety for EuroNCAP have resulted in more curved bonnets with lower primary impact location and removal of additional hazards such as bull bars.

The Parliamentary Advisory Council for Transport Safety has called for the Govt to align with EU rules on Pedestrian safety including the General and Pedestrian Safety Regulations - a package of 15 measures to improve safety (many of which were UK led).

Hardly seems laissez faire to have the EU actively working to improve pedestrian safety from vehicles does it?

See also Regulation 78/2009 on the type-approval of motor vehicles with regard to the protection of pedestrians and other vulnerable road users which has applied since 2009
https://eur-lex.europa.eu/EN/legal-...of-pedestrians-and-vulnerable-road-users.html

The key point that I took about it was "body injuries substantially higher".

The important bit, imo, is not "actively working" but from the progress of that work, and the impact that motor manufacturing lobbyists have on those decisions.

I don't know how fast that progress is, or whether it could be faster, and don't know if you have any inside information on it, but suspect that it is a case of people looking at the research and favouring the elements in it that most align with their views. You see head injuries lower, I see body injuries substantially higher

There are many studies in the US about the extra danger to pedestrians from SUVs, but that comes from a country where SUVs can be huge compared to Europe and the overlap between SUV and pick-up truck is different.

 

[icowden]

The key point that I took about it was "body injuries substantially higher".
The important bit, imo, is not "actively working" but from the progress of that work, and the impact that motor manufacturing lobbyists have on those decisions.

I was more replying to @Ming the Merciless point about safety within the UK and EU being laissez faire. There is active safety legislation

There are many studies in the US about the extra danger to pedestrians from SUVs, but that comes from a country where SUVs can be huge compared to Europe and the overlap between SUV and pick-up truck is different.

I did find a paper somewhere which also explains that many cars were built as SUVs in the US (thus driving popularity) because it meant that US manufacturers could bypass all sorts of safety and emission tests because they count as "off road vehicles".

 

[Ming the Merciless]

I was more replying to @Ming the Merciless point about safety within the UK and EU being laissez faire. There is active safety legislation

Then you’ll be able to report on the many and multiple laws restricting passenger cars to protect vulnerable users. Things like restricting the weight, dimensions, acceleration etc etc.

 

[icowden]

Then you’ll be able to report on the many and multiple laws restricting passenger cars to protect vulnerable users. Things like restricting the weight, dimensions, acceleration etc etc.

See EuroNCAP and EU Regulation 78/2009 on the type-approval of motor vehicles with regard to the protection of pedestrians and other vulnerable road users which has applied since 2009 - I mentioned this on my previous post.

 

[Ming the Merciless]

See EuroNCAP and EU Regulation 78/2009 on the type-approval of motor vehicles with regard to the protection of pedestrians and other vulnerable road users which has applied since 2009 - I mentioned this on my previous post.

Weak as I’m sure you’ll agree.

 

[matticus]

See EuroNCAP and EU Regulation 78/2009 on the type-approval of motor vehicles with regard to the protection of pedestrians and other vulnerable road users which has applied since 2009 - I mentioned this on my previous post.

Or in other words - they're not as bad as they COULD be!

 

[Jody]

Then you’ll be able to report on the many and multiple laws restricting passenger cars to protect vulnerable users. Things like restricting the weight, dimensions, acceleration etc etc.

Two of those are going to have very little effect on pedestrian safety

 

[matticus]

Two of those are going to have very little effect on pedestrian safety

This again!