Steep climbs or time in the saddle

[Radius]

Just ask the other forum members on here how fast I went up hills on the interim ride.

'Tis true, 'tis true it has to be said.

 

[jimboalee]

Sitting and spinning up a hill is OK. It just uses a lower gear, which is irrelavant when Power is calculated.

But, please consider some training on the incline Standing and using a lower cadence.
The reasoning behind my plee is you will develop the muscles which are useful when accelerating round a traffic island or getting out of the way of an inconsiderate motorist.

In theory, climbing a hill is overcoming the acceleration due to gravity but maintaining the same forward velocity. ie, you are accelerating without getting faster.

Once you have developed strength to climb a steepish hill standing up and pulling the pedals all the way round, you have the tools to accelerate away from that bus.

 

[Paul_L]

Wow!

thanks for all the advice.

I have found that by sitting back in the saddle, and pushing a low gear climbing is easier. But i'm not strong enough to maintain this on steep climbs, and i find myself having to get out of the saddle just to maintain momemtum.

I find in the saddle i feel more comfortable and can get into a bit of a rhythm. This rhythm is completely lost when i have to stand up and my breathing gets all to cock.

I think i will find a short hilly circuit near home (not difficult in Shipley), and do hill reps and monitor progress over time.

 

[marinyork]

I have found that by adding in hills on a regular circuit it seems to make (n-5) gradients easier. Also low continuous climbs e.g. 2-5% for a few miles seems to do a lot of good.

 

[a_n_t]

As I have said before don't quote only half my posts and then call me ignorant when you yourself have not even given an opinion on how best to do hill training.

so what happens when a climb gets so steep that you can only generate enough power by standing? You wont see many people "sitting and spinning" when the gradients get over 20%, even with compact gearing. So my point is it needs to be practised.

eg.... mow cop 25% on the cheshire cat yesterday, lets see how many are sat down?

http://www.robcrayton.fotopic.net/c1674113.html


I found 1. if they're not standing, they're walking.

 

[a_n_t]

I find in the saddle i feel more comfortable and can get into a bit of a rhythm. This rhythm is completely lost when i have to stand up and my breathing gets all to cock.

which is why you need to practise

 

[Steve B]

Standing on the pedals will give a brief burst of acceleration, but at the cost of increased energy expenditure. Watch the big boys in the mountains on one of the tours. For the vast majority of the time they are in the saddle, but for a burst they will almost always stand to make an attack. Pantani was the master at this. The increased energy expenditure means you cannot maintain such a push however, Ulrich used to grind a big gear back up to Armstrong, Armstrong himself would always prefer to stand on the pedals in a low gear at a high cadence.

I would suggest that there is no right answer, everyone will ride differently so everyone will train differently. If you prefer to grind then distance is not as important as upping resistance. If you prefer to spin a low gear then endurance will become more important than absolute power. Look at how you currently ride, decide whether you want to ride differently and take it from there. A good first step is often to decide where you want to be - do you want to climb faster, or climb steeper gradients, or climb multiple gradients on a longer ride? Once you have that sorted then you can start to decide how to meet that target.

Steve.

 

[jimboalee]

Raising a mass ( you and your bike ) against gravity takes a certain amount of energy if you complete the upward distance in the same time.

It DOES NOT matter if you sit or stand, the time is the same so the overall energy ( or WORK ) is the same.

Confusion is arising because ( to some cyclists ) standing and grinding FEELS more energetic. It is if the upward velocity increases.

Given two cyclists who have the same mass; when they climb the same hill in the same time, they have done the same amount of work, irrespective of whatever riding style they have.


There is a 'cross debate' about to open now after I suggest the transfer of water bottles from cages to back pockets for a steep climb.
For those who like to stand, advantage; those who like to sit, no advantage?

 

[jimboalee]

Before any of you state -

Transfering your water bottles to someone else's cages is the advantage.

 

[montage]

Interesting point Jimboalee.... but how about if you take standing up on the flat compared with sitting down on the flat?

Surely the "sitting down" muscles are far more effecient than the standing up muscles....I may be talking utter bullexcrement here, but I would definately say from experience (limited) that standing up usually puffs you out faster.

 

[Steve B]

Interesting point Jimboalee.... but how about if you take standing up on the flat compared with sitting down on the flat?

Surely the "sitting down" muscles are far more effecient than the standing up muscles....I may be talking utter bullexcrement here, but I would definately say from experience (limited) that standing up usually puffs you out faster.

Tis because when sitting your top half is supported by sitting on the saddle. When standing you are moving your top half up and down as well.

Steve.

 

[Smoothhound]

Raising a mass ( you and your bike ) against gravity takes a certain amount of energy if you complete the upward distance in the same time.

It DOES NOT matter if you sit or stand, the time is the same so the overall energy ( or WORK ) is the same.

Confusion is arising because ( to some cyclists ) standing and grinding FEELS more energetic. It is if the upward velocity increases.

Given two cyclists who have the same mass; when they climb the same hill in the same time, they have done the same amount of work, irrespective of whatever riding style they have.

There is a 'cross debate' about to open now after I suggest the transfer of water bottles from cages to back pockets for a steep climb.
For those who like to stand, advantage; those who like to sit, no advantage?

This misses the point a bit since the assumption here is that both techniques are equal in terms of efficiency which I doubt is the case. I think that standing is less efficient however that's based on a random sample of 1 cyclist

 

[jimboalee]

This misses the point a bit since the assumption here is that both techniques are equal in terms of efficiency which I doubt is the case. I think that standing is less efficient however that's based on a random sample of 1 cyclist

Don't argue with Joule, Watt and Newton.
Ignore them at your peril.

 

[Randochap]

It's been often said. 'Hills never hurt less, you just get up them quicker.'

+1

Hill repeats help immeasurably. Steep hills are welcome excuse to get out of the saddle and get the blood flowing!

 

[montage]

+1

Hill repeats help immeasurably. Steep hills are welcome excuse to get out of the saddle and get the blood flowing!

A welcome excuse....for a few seconds