Speed Limits and Cyclists.

[gaz]

We all know that some cyclists say that speed limits don't apply to cyclists..

I'm looking for a creditable source that states what the situation is with cyclists and speed limits.

I've had a look in the highway code, and various other places, and i can't find a definative answer that says it as it is.

 

[addictfreak]

Dont have the written evidence, but I would imagine the law applies to all road users.

 

[addictfreak]

Just found this:

CYCLING FURIOUSLY?
It's an in-joke in cycling that cyclists can't be booked for speeding but can be fined for "pedalling furiously." Many cyclists list being cited for "cycling furiously" as one of their life ambitions. Professor David S. Wall, Head of the University of Leeds Law School, a professor of criminal justice lists his hobby as: Cycling (Furiously)
However, these legal eagles say they have been unable to find a a reference to such a cycling offence in Blackstone's Criminal Practice or in Halsbury's Laws of England.
Which is odd, as Christopher McKenzie, an Australian barrister, pointed Bikeforall to these cases: Taylor v. Goodwin (1879) 4 QBD 228, a case where the Queen's Bench Division held, on appeal, that a cyclist was appropriately convicted by a magistrate for furious riding of a bicycle. The dicta of Justice Melor in the case has been cited and followed in a number of cases since: see, for example, Smith v. Kynnersley [1903] 1 KB 788 (cyclist not liable to pay bridge toll) and Corkery v. Carpenter [1951] I KB 102 (cyclist liable for offence where cycling drunk).

Although a legal eagle searching Blackstones will not find a specific offence of "furious cycling", cyclists can nonetheless be convicted for "wanton and furious driving".
The wording of S35 of the Offences Against the Person Act 1861 (as amended by the Criminal Justice Act 1948 (c. 58), s. 1(2)) is as follows: “35. Drivers of carriages injuring persons by furious driving Whosoever, having the charge of any carriage or vehicle, shall by wanton or furious driving or racing, or other wilful misconduct, or by wilful neglect, do or cause to be done any bodily harm to any person whatsoever, shall be guilty of a misdemeanor, and being convicted thereof shall be liable, at the discretion of the court, to be imprisoned for any term not exceeding two years.”

http://www.bikeforall.net/content/cycling_and_the_law.php

 

[Arch]

As I understand it (so this isn't definitive, sorry) you can't be done for speeding at a specific limit, since don't necessarily, by law, have fitted a way of knowing your speed. But you can be done for riding dangerously or inconsiderately, and speed could play a part in that - even well under any road limit - doing 15-20mph on a crowded shared path for example.

Morally, I think we have as much responsibility to watch our speed as a motorist does, esp since we tend to have less controlled braking (and indeed are more likely to come off badly in any crash than a driver). I very rarely reach 20mph (probably the only limit I could break), it's true, but if I did routinely, I don't think it would be a suitable speed to use in any built up area.

 

[Downward]

On the subject of speed limits, is it possible to get flashed by a traffic speed camera on a bike or am I wasting my time?

As regards speeding, the provisions of the Road Traffic Act 1984, which set out the speed limits for particular vehicles on particular classes of roads, apply only to motor vehicles and therefore specifically exclude pedal cyclists. I do not know if a traffic speed camera could flash a cyclist. However, I am aware of a comment made by a Sergeant in the Camera Enforcement Unit of West Midlands Police published in the Daily Mail April 1st 2000, where he says that ‘in theory’ any vehicle breaking the speed limit could activate a camera, but that he was not aware of any cyclists being caught speeding by camera. In any event there would clearly be a problem in identifying the speeding cyclist.

 

[Downward]

On the subject of speed limits, is it possible to get flashed by a traffic speed camera on a bike or am I wasting my time?

As regards speeding, the provisions of the Road Traffic Act 1984, which set out the speed limits for particular vehicles on particular classes of roads, apply only to motor vehicles and therefore specifically exclude pedal cyclists. I do not know if a traffic speed camera could flash a cyclist. However, I am aware of a comment made by a Sergeant in the Camera Enforcement Unit of West Midlands Police published in the Daily Mail April 1st 2000, where he says that ‘in theory’ any vehicle breaking the speed limit could activate a camera, but that he was not aware of any cyclists being caught speeding by camera. In any event there would clearly be a problem in identifying the speeding cyclist.

So i guess the only other way you could be caught is by a following police car who would have to record your speed over a certain distance.

 

[gaz]

i've gone through camears at over 36mph, at that speed it's hard to look round and see if it's flashing!

The way the speed camera works is by using radar. so anything going through it at over the threashold will set it off.

 

[Downward]

It may be possible but identifiying you would prove difficult

 

[aJohnson]

It may be possible but identifiying you would prove difficult

Well... if you're riding a pink bike...

I mean how many people own a pink bike...

 

[marinyork]

We all know that some cyclists say that speed limits don't apply to cyclists..

I'm looking for a creditable source that states what the situation is with cyclists and speed limits.

I've had a look in the highway code, and various other places, and i can't find a definative answer that says it as it is.

The HC has a definitive answer when it comes to the laws, you obey all laws (that apply to you). That is what adds confusion, plus a bit of bad wording sometimes.

This is why people get confused as they assume all bits apply to everyone without a hierarchy. A good example is people who refuse to believe no motor vehicles signs don't include bicycles. People argue cyclists who are going past them are breaking the law. They would be if they applied to them.

 

[beanzontoast]

I agree with Arch about the moral obligation.

I don't understand why cyclists wonder about speed limits - unless they're planning to exceed them? Surely if the limit is, say, 30mph what that means (in common sense terms) is that the maximum safe speed for any road user is 30mph -and in practice, it will be less due to road conditions, weather, traffic, peds etc. Exceeding a speed limit on a bike is not safer than doing it in a car IMO.

If a cyclist had an accident and was found to have been exceeding the speed limit, surely this would count against them?

 

[gaz]

I've checked the road traffice act of 1984 section 6 from points 81 to 89. and all laws apply only to a motor veichel.

and a bicycle doesn't fall under motor veichel.

 

[scaryant]

There was a thing on the BBC News one morning about cyclists being caught on an esplanade somewhere in the UK by a cop with a speed gun.

Here you go.

Though admittedly, there is nothing in the article that says they were/could be fined (for speeding) but the implication is they could I suppose - but presumably not by police under the Highway Code but maybe under a council by-law. Here's an earlier article from 2004 sighting the same problem in the same area (obviously the warnings aint working) that mentions "fines".

 

[wafflycat]

In general, speed limits do NOT apply to pedal cycles. There are a few places where they do - but specific byelaws are brought in for that purpose. The HC is quite clear where the word(s) MUST or MUST NOT it refers to a law and you have to look at the detail of the specific law to see if it refers to pedal cycles. As regards speed limits referred to in the HC, it does give a clue, as s.124 has a handy table to go with it, to list speed limtis for different types of vehicle.. pedal cycles are not listed.

Saying that, there are specific cycling offences where if plod feels you are going too fast, you can have your collar felt.

But even though the speed limits don't apply to pedal cycles, you ahve to ask yourself whether it's particularly clever to exceed them (if you are able to do so), as they do reflect what is thought to be the maximum speed for that stretch of road in good conditions...

 

[PaulSB]

In any event there would clearly be a problem in identifying the speeding cyclist.

It's also a problem to identify a working speed camera!! Could get a touch expensive testing them out in the car.

Locally we have a number of those signs that tell you your speed and then show a happy or unhappy smiley. I often register with those but haven't managed anyhting above 22 mph yet - none of them are located in spots where I could reach 30mph. I'd suggest these are your best bet for finding out what the possibilities are.