Speed limit consultation (Scotland)

[Drago]

I can see about zero advantage to having a camera somewhere where it is difficult to power, difficult to keep the lens clean, difficult to maintain, difficult to defend from someone with a common household hammer, just difficult in general actually,

People won't be inclined to attack what they don't know is there. If ever installed, only one in 10,000 might have a camera and Johnny Scumbag won't know which.

Like cats eyes, they're self cleaning - the rubber casing flexes and wipes the catseye - or lens - clean when driven across.

Power is... easy really.

The civil liberties complainers are a far bigger obstacle to deployment than any physical limitations.

 

[smutchin]

However, police forces are generally weak willed, and of course if you install them in rural areas it's more ker-ching for them. Hence why you have massive amounts of enforcement on motorways and major roads, and sod all in town.

You're contradicting yourself. The purpose of cameras is to reduce casualties on the roads through "visible enforcement" (hence why they're painted bright yellow and well signposted, rather than being hidden in cats eyes - they're emphatically not trying to entrap you). If they were purely about making money, they would be installed mainly in urban sites where they would catch a far higher number of offenders.

 

[Glenn]

As far as I'm aware (most likely wrong though), the 20mph limit is illegal unless there is an amendment order in place for each road and signed by the Secretary of Transport.

 

[smutchin]

As far as I'm aware (most likely wrong though), the 20mph limit is illegal unless there is an amendment order in place for each road and signed by the Secretary of Transport.

Oh, well just drive at whatever farking speed you like then.

 

[Slick]

Edinburgh has extensive 20mph zones and is being encouraged to think again about it

http://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.c...after-manchester-halts-20mph-scheme-1-4389354

Not my city, but I do wonder about the clamour to be seen to do the right thing rather than what works for all.

 

[smutchin]

Not my city, but I do wonder about the clamour to be seen to do the right thing rather than what works for all.

What I wonder about is the reluctance to embrace 20 limits, and the righteous zeal with which people look for reasons to ignore or challenge them. Why are people so keen to drive faster in the kind of residential areas where 20 limits are imposed?

As noted in the article, part of the reason for the disappointing results in the Manchester scheme is lack of enforcement from the police and lack of enthusiasm from the council.

 

[Slick]

What I wonder about is the reluctance to embrace 20 limits, and the righteous zeal with which people look for reasons to ignore or challenge them. Why are people so keen to drive faster in the kind of residential areas where 20 limits are imposed?

As noted in the article, part of the reason for the disappointing results in the Manchester scheme is lack of enforcement from the police and lack of enthusiasm from the council.

I'm certainly not reluctant to embrace anything that would improve my personal safety whilst on the bike. The truth is, I don't believe it's a catch all answer to all our ills. I was going to quote a few examples, but I thought better of it. We have a reasonably competent government in Scotland at the moment, but sometimes I do suspect they are very keen to be politically perfect without fully considering the full impact of their decisions. 20mph in housing area's, most certainly but every square mile of a city seems a bit much and may even add to the congestion and pollution.

 

[User33236]

Edinburgh certainly hasn't updated its site regarding its 20mph rollout since January 2016 despite the March 2017 article in the Edinburgh Evening News and its myth busting page hasn't changed in even longer:-

http://www.edinburgh.gov.uk/news/article/1743/busting_the_myths_around_edinburghs_20mph_roll-out

 

[Slick]

Edinburgh certainly hasn't updated its site regarding its 20mph rollout since January 2016 despite the March 2017 article in the Edinburgh Evening News and its myth busting page hasn't changed in even longer:-

http://www.edinburgh.gov.uk/news/article/1743/busting_the_myths_around_edinburghs_20mph_roll-out

I assume the reality is somewhat different to the reports?

 

[User33236]

I assume the reality is somewhat different to the reports?

I now live in a 20mph area and cycle through a variety of speed limits on the way to and from work.

In the real world the 20mph limit is largely ignored by a reasonable percentage of drivers but if I am riding at, or close, to 20mph in a 20mph zone drivers are much more tolerant. Do bear in mind however that up until 5 weeks ago I was commuting in Greater Manchester and therefore the speed limit alone may not be the only factor in my perceived increase in driver tolerance.

 

[smutchin]

The truth is, I don't believe it's a catch all answer to all our ills.

Nor do I. I just don't see why anyone would object to a 20 limit in any urban setting, nor can I admit any legitimate reason for wanting to drive faster.

may even add to the congestion and pollution.

Yes, this one is often trotted out, but the evidence for the claim is somewhat less than compelling.

 

[Slick]

Nor do I. I just don't see why anyone would object to a 20 limit in any urban setting, nor can I admit any legitimate reason for wanting to drive faster.

Why not 10 mph?

Yes, this one is often trotted out, but the evidence for the claim is somewhat less than compelling.

Depends very much on whose carrying out the research. They once thought speed humps were a good idea.

 

[Slick]

I now live in a 20mph area and cycle through a variety of speed limits on the way to and from work.

In the real world the 20mph limit is largely ignored by a reasonable percentage of drivers but if I am riding at, or close, to 20mph in a 20mph zone drivers are much more tolerant. Do bear in mind however that up until 5 weeks ago I was commuting in Greater Manchester and therefore the speed limit alone may not be the only factor in my perceived increase in driver tolerance.

Hopefully it's the speed limit that's helping you out, as a nation were not known for our tolerance.

 

[oldwheels]

In some of our local streets 20 mph signs have been put up including the street I live on. Most drivers I have pointed this out to have not actually seen the signs and only became aware of them when they were pointed out to them. The police put up monitoring cameras on one street and discovered that 85% of drivers ignored the signs. Those who were recorded as obeying the limit were probably just parking or driving slowly by accident. What action was taken? None! I have taken to pointing out to as many as possible that most drivers cannot read properly and see a number 5 instead of a 2 and think the limit is 50. Much hilarity but no other effect.