Sky going to kill the business?

[coffeejo]

What were you thinking when you saw Chris Froome on the podium in the Champs-Élysées, with the Arc de Triomphe in the background, as ‘God Save the Queen’ was played? It’s a question for British readers. Did you scream ‘Hop off, you frogs! We’ve won your cycle race again’?

No, I wondered (and commented on the TDF thread) why the national anthem was being played when the winner rode for himself and his team, not his country. And once I'd finished cringing at just how bloody awful that dirge is, I congratulated the guy for three weeks of dogged persistence - and extended that to everyone who finished the Tour, no matter how chirpy/depressing their national anthem is.

Sorry, what was the question?

 

[Slioch]

It is a bloody awful dirge too @coffeejo. It's depressing and embarrassing. More than time for a change.

I like the Scots attitude. You spend decades ranting on about some obscure verse in the national anthem being anti-Scottish ("rebellious Scots to quell" or something), and then you go and pick an unashamedly anti-English song as your national anthem.

 

[mjr]

I like the Scots attitude. You spend decades ranting on about some obscure verse in the national anthem being anti-Scottish ("rebellious Scots to quell" or something), and then you go and pick an unashamedly anti-English song as your national anthem.

Are we talking about the same anthem? "There is only one set of lyrics registered with PRS and MCPS, written by Ben Kelly in 1990. Other versions have been tried but this version is the one used at the Scottish Rugby games and other ceremonies. They describe a moment in history when James the 6th of Scotland became James the 1st of England and in doing so united all the land and feuding clans for the first and probably the only time."

 

[mcshroom]

Not that one - Flower of Scotland
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flower_of_Scotland

 

[Slioch]

Yeah, that one about Edward Longshanks, aka The Hammer of the Scots.

And stood against him
Proud Edward's army
And sent him homeward
Tae think again

Now don't get me wrong here. I think it's a great tune, and the fervour with which it's sung is genuine. Not at all like the insipid tune we have in England.

 

[Flying_Monkey]

An interesting viewpoint on why both French and British sports fans have a downer on Team Sky on Spiked magazine. Here.

There is indeed a dislike of Sky and the business model of cycling in the UK and in France. However, there is also a particular dislike for the as-far-as-we know, clean, Froome, that is in interesting contrast to the love for Contador and Valverde, who come from equally large business-backed teams and who are known to have doped. Indeed, other Sky riders don't attract the same opprobrium. The answer is right in front of everyone's eyes: Contador and Valverde are dashing, good-looking men with some style on the bike, whereas Froome is an ungainly and uncharismatic weirdo.

 

[Mattonsea]

I do think Froome fits in to mold like Sampras or Schumacher.The consistant winner but who suffers from a neutral personality. I kind of get fed up with the plucky Brit tag.

 

[400bhp]

Both of the above.

 

[oldroadman]

All this business model stuff reduces my will to live. Cycling is not like others sports. There are clubs (basically very amateur and the better for it) and there are small "teams" (little ones pretending to be pros which they ain't, but enjoying wearing pretty kit) usually all identified to an area or small business. Then there are proper teams - UCI registered - which are run by xxx cycling and carry a sponsor branding. So team xyz is actually run by "Bloggs Sports" who take sponsor money and employ riders and staff. When the contract expires, another sponsor moves in. Bloggs Sports continues. Fans will never support Bloggs Sports because it's not like supporting Wigan FC who have a "shirt sponsor" amongst other (bigger) income streams. So the system is not so unstable as it seems at first. It would be great to get more stable money in, but that's simply not how business works - take a contract, get what you want from it, end of contract, someone else sees it works and hopefully the team continues. Also consider that a lot or team "sponsors" right up to division 1 level in many sports, are rich people indulging their interest using the money their business generates, and getting a tax benefit from advertising (sponsor) costs. This is not sponsorship, it's patronage, and has always gone on. Which is why Oleg likes t ride in team cars and pretend he's a DS, the bloke is a fan at heart and indulging his fantasy, and has the cash to do it, so why not?
Other points - salary caps are nonsense, everyone will find ways round them (pension schemes, share options, - see banks for examples of that).
Rider limits - the UCI has a maximum allowed roster for teams already, and it's probably going to reduce from 28 to 22. This will make life very difficult for everyone. Not a good idea in my own view. End of season races will be a parade of knackered riders!
ORM signing off for a kip, bit of a ride to do this weekend.

 

[deptfordmarmoset]

All this business model stuff reduces my will to live. Cycling is not like others sports. There are clubs (basically very amateur and the better for it) and there are small "teams" (little ones pretending to be pros which they ain't, but enjoying wearing pretty kit) usually all identified to an area or small business. Then there are proper teams - UCI registered - which are run by xxx cycling and carry a sponsor branding. So team xyz is actually run by "Bloggs Sports" who take sponsor money and employ riders and staff. When the contract expires, another sponsor moves in. Bloggs Sports continues. Fans will never support Bloggs Sports because it's not like supporting Wigan FC who have a "shirt sponsor" amongst other (bigger) income streams. So the system is not so unstable as it seems at first. It would be great to get more stable money in, but that's simply not how business works - take a contract, get what you want from it, end of contract, someone else sees it works and hopefully the team continues. Also consider that a lot or team "sponsors" right up to division 1 level in many sports, are rich people indulging their interest using the money their business generates, and getting a tax benefit from advertising (sponsor) costs. This is not sponsorship, it's patronage, and has always gone on. Which is why Oleg likes t ride in team cars and pretend he's a DS, the bloke is a fan at heart and indulging his fantasy, and has the cash to do it, so why not?
Other points - salary caps are nonsense, everyone will find ways round them (pension schemes, share options, - see banks for examples of that).
Rider limits - the UCI has a maximum allowed roster for teams already, and it's probably going to reduce from 28 to 22. This will make life very difficult for everyone. Not a good idea in my own view. End of season races will be a parade of knackered riders!
ORM signing off for a kip, bit of a ride to do this weekend.

Have a good ride tomorrow. Meanwhile, this thread is largely about business models - and therefore sponsorship - so I was wondering what you made of One Pro Cycling - Matt Prior, the ex-England wicketkeeper's team. They settled on a name independent of sponsors and, from what I've seen in the blurb, are aiming to keep continuity in the name while sponsors may change (currently F&F I believe). They also have ambitions to get beyond UK cyling but seem to be a presence but not yet a force. Any thoughts on the approach?

 

[oldroadman]

Have a good ride tomorrow. Meanwhile, this thread is largely about business models - and therefore sponsorship - so I was wondering what you made of One Pro Cycling - Matt Prior, the ex-England wicketkeeper's team. They settled on a name independent of sponsors and, from what I've seen in the blurb, are aiming to keep continuity in the name while sponsors may change (currently F&F I believe). They also have ambitions to get beyond UK cyling but seem to be a presence but not yet a force. Any thoughts on the approach?

It works well at the level they are at right now. Whether it is sustainable should they get into division 2 is different. If I was a company boss sponsoring a team at that level, spending seven figure sums every year, with the possibility of getting into bigger race on live TV (not just the BC edits of elite series stuff tucked into Eurosport corners) then I would want my name big and bold as the team name. The team owner and management would remain the same (e.g. Riis Cycling - Saxo Bank), the name on the kit and the "public" team name would be that of the major sponsoring company. Simple value for money economics. One Pro is hardly a big well known brand like, say Nottingham Forest. However, applause to Mr Prior for getting stuck in and sticking his head above the parapet, good luck to him and the team in their quest for greater things.

 

[mjr]

Oh I thought they were sponsored by http://www.pro-bikegear.com/en-gb !

 

[oldroadman]

No, not Pro Bike Gear (an unfortunate clash of names). One Pro cycling are just that, and have F&F (Tesco clothing line) as their main sponsor. I had a smile listening to race radio a little while ago, One Pro were driving a chase, and a voice says "One Pro at the head of the peloton driving hard", another voice says "Every little helps"....