Either that or a new 9sp Sora at £90-100, and I haven't had much luck with them recently, by the time someone has told me its unfixable ( I think part of the ratchet mechanism has failed) time off the road ect..... Like I said I could do the Tiagra for £22 less in fact I could get a set up for £142 using Tiagra shifters and a Tiagra rear cassette, but not really in the ratios I want, though i could use the 105 cassette instead pushing the price to the mid £150's, but my way of thinking is if this has got to be done you might as well spend the extra £22 at this stage, though not 100% sure i want 105's but I dont really want Tiagra's with the indicators, never used them on the Sora's always generally knew where I was, middle or either end is usually close enough, also I am not convinced going to 10sp will be any better as the extra gear is a 12th rear instead of the lower end (this comes from having smaller rings on the front), I have been looking at options to make a 13-30 (13/14/15/16/17/19/21/23/27/30 or something) but the problem is not to many cassettes to choice from I would really like to set up something like 13/14/15/16/17/18/19/21/24/28 but the only ones with an 18th are Ultegra and I would need to get a locking 13th I can get one but its over £10, i will look further into with more experience