Should truck drivers have their licences suspended for using mobile phones?‏

[martint235]

The problem is not punishment but enforcement of existing laws HOWEVER [OK a tiny bit OT here] I do have one question IF a cyclist is stopped fpr [for example] jumping a red light should they be banned too ? Now don't kick off without thinking here it's not the damage YOU may do but the accident you may cause by someone having to dodge you. For one group to bang on and on about everybody else being punished for breaking the law and basically have no fears themselves is just a tiny bit hippocritical. Do I agree phone users should be punished - of course. Do I think cyclists should act as some sort of secret police [and in 99% of cases have no fear of any retribution if THEY do anything wrong, and please don't try to mention the almost non existant fines for dangerous cycling or whatever] well no too.

I think there should be a period of zero tolerance.

In summer, the police could recruit all those people who take short term jobs over Xmas with the Royal Mail and have a 6 week crack down on all traffic offences: RLJ by motor or bike; mobile phone use by driver or cyclist; riding on pavements; parking on pavements etc. Unfortunately there's probably a legal hurdle to this but hey ho.

 

[Nigel-YZ1]

It has a to take shock tactics to start people obeying laws. Yes, 6 month ban, no leniency.

 

[numbnuts]

It has a to take shock tactics to start people obeying laws. Yes, 6 month ban, no leniency.

....and their phoned crushed

 

[Accy cyclist]

Add to the list tractor drivers! I live in a semi rural area and during the spring and summer these things don't half hold up the traffic,having conveys of vehicles following them. If you manage to eventually overtake them you'll find many of them are blabbing away on their phones. The trailers they pull are wider than the vehicle they're supposed to be in charge of but these dimwhits are more likely to be telling their country bumpkin mates how many sheep they've sh.gg.d rather than watching out for that trailer wiping out a cyclist!

 

[marknotgeorge]

[QUOTE 3070801, member: 9609"]...and there should be no leniency if your job depends on your licence.[/QUOTE]

There shouldn't be any leniency at all, for anyone. If your job, or your wellbeing (or that of anyone else in your care) depends on having a driving licence, sodding well drive properly.

 

[Trevor_P]

Speaking as an lgv driver with 30 years under my belt, the traffic commissioner has held the right to revoke vocational licences for a few years now. There is no need to make it mandatory, rather invest the effort in proper policing so that common sense can be used.

Regarding the disproportionate number of pedestrian and cyclist deaths involving lgvs, there were 14 cyclists killed in London last year, of which 9 involved lgvs. How many drivers were charged? None.

Driving in London on a regular basis, I probably have a couple of near misses every year. And I am a courteous professional driver who tries to do things the right way. I see cyclists who are tired and exhausted failing to think about what they are doing, putting themselves in harms way. Many not even realising they are doing it. The same goes for pedestrians and other drivers.

Anything that takes your mind off of the task that is driving, be it mobile phones, iPhones, chatty passengers, eating, the radio etc should be avoided.

Forward thinking is vital, but many don't even know what it is let alone practice it.

 

[TheDoctor]

Difference is, if I as a cyclist don't concentrate, I get hurt.
If a lorry driver doesn't concentrate, I die. And we see it all too often.

 

[TheDoctor]

In that case i best remove all my passenger seats.

Oh, don't be a dick. If your driving has deteriorated that much since you passed your test, then just stop driving!

 

[Trevor_P]

Difference is, if I as a cyclist don't concentrate, I get hurt.
If a lorry driver doesn't concentrate, I die. And we see it all too often.

The point is that often the cyclist or pedestrian doesn't concentrate, gets in a position where the lgv driver cannot see them, with the inevitable terrible consequences. Cyclists and pedestrians in general need to be more aware of the blind spots associated with lgv's and STAY out of them, no matter how much of a hurry they are in or how safe they perceive their actions to be.

 

[shouldbeinbed]

The point is that often the cyclist or pedestrian doesn't concentrate, gets in a position where the lgv driver cannot see them, with the inevitable terrible consequences. Cyclists and pedestrians in general need to be more aware of the blind spots associated with lgv's and STAY out of them, no matter how much of a hurry they are in or how safe they perceive their actions to be.

I agree entirely with the sentiment but in practice how do you propose to educate every, even once in a blue moon, cyclist as to where the blind spots are. It is obvious to you and fellow LGV drivers where the weaknesses of lorry design and visibility are, but not to the likes of me who has never sat in one. I tend to go for the keep well out of the way and don't filter strategy to stay safe but every single day in all modes of transport from walking to the biggest of trucks I see selfish, me first behaviour that makes me cringe in fear for the worst case scenario. It includes trucks bullying their way through against their right of way vs smaller vehicles or seeming to assume because I'm on a bike there will be room for us both at the same time & they don't need to wait for me to clear a narrow / obstruction point.

people are unaware, some are selfish d**kheads who will always go 'me first' regardless, but without showing someone, how can you expect them to understand the problems they cause you or the peril they put themselves in. To do what you want without hearts and minds requires either total segregation (not going to happen) or the banning / draconian legal enforcement of one type of vehicle 'supremecy' over others and imposition of first and second class citizens on the roads.

Also though as much as educating people about the troubles of poor visibility from a high cab, there should be quid pro quo of having drivers of such vehicles forced to be on a bike within a foot or so of a moving wheel nearly as tall as they are to understand what it feels like to have something bearing down on you with no intention of waiting or slowing when you're already quite rightly mid manoeuvre or traversing a line of parked cars, delivery truck etc.

 

[Trevor_P]

The problem for the LGV driver with regard to visibility is that Blind spots are EXACTLY that. People who don't drive just don't understand or those who don't care. It's when the truck is stationary or slow moving that the problem becomes worse. LGV's may appear to take up strange positions at some junctions, even 50 yards away from the junction. They are not doing it to be awkward or to bully. They are doing it for safety, to PREVENT other road users from putting themselves in a vulnerable position, and to take the optimum route through the junction, roundabout or whatever the obstacle ahead is. In most cabs there are six mirrors for the driver, but you can only look at one at a time. The dangerous places to be are either side of the cab, close in front of the cab, and right behind the trailer. The number of times I've gone to pull away at traffic lights only to see a cyclist who has crept up the nearside and is sitting directly in the nearside blind spot; pull away in front of me is frightening. Knowing the width of the truck, and observing the mirrors for hazards whilst stationary, you still miss the odd one or two every year. A slipped gear, a pedal clipped kerb and the cyclist would be off and under the truck without the driver even knowing about it.

I understand that there are impatient truck drivers out there too, but they are the exception and need reporting. They are idiots that shouldn't be on the road. And there are more of them than many care to admit.

I'll take some photo's of the visibility from a typical cab so you get some idea. In the meantime, next time you see a truck, and you even have to think whether or not its OK to squeeze alongside, Don't. Just wait behind for your own safety.

 

[glasgowcyclist]

Cyclists and pedestrians in general need to be more aware of the blind spots associated with lgv's and STAY out of them, no matter how much of a hurry they are in or how safe they perceive their actions to be.

It's not the responsibility of pedestrians and others to make up for a vehicle's blind spots, that's the responsibility of the driver.

I have blind spots in my car and it's up to me to make sure before, for example, changing lanes, that there isn't another vehicle in my blind spot. I don't put the onus on others to keep out of that zone.

GC

 

[theclaud]

The problem for the LGV driver with regard to visibility is that Blind spots are EXACTLY that. People who don't drive just don't understand or those who don't care. It's when the truck is stationary or slow moving that the problem becomes worse. LGV's may appear to take up strange positions at some junctions, even 50 yards away from the junction. They are not doing it to be awkward or to bully. They are doing it for safety, to PREVENT other road users from putting themselves in a vulnerable position, and to take the optimum route through the junction, roundabout or whatever the obstacle ahead is. In most cabs there are six mirrors for the driver, but you can only look at one at a time. The dangerous places to be are either side of the cab, close in front of the cab, and right behind the trailer. The number of times I've gone to pull away at traffic lights only to see a cyclist who has crept up the nearside and is sitting directly in the nearside blind spot; pull away in front of me is frightening. Knowing the width of the truck, and observing the mirrors for hazards whilst stationary, you still miss the odd one or two every year. A slipped gear, a pedal clipped kerb and the cyclist would be off and under the truck without the driver even knowing about it.

I understand that there are impatient truck drivers out there too, but they are the exception and need reporting. They are idiots that shouldn't be on the road. And there are more of them than many care to admit.

I'll take some photo's of the visibility from a typical cab so you get some idea. In the meantime, next time you see a truck, and you even have to think whether or not its OK to squeeze alongside, Don't. Just wait behind for your own safety.

Trans: These vehicles are unfit to share our roads, so we expect more vulnerable road users (ie everybody) to simply stay out of the way.

 

[stuee147]

i think yes and also i agree with others that it should be the same for all no exceptions.
i do think phones are a big distraction but the so can a radio or cd if your singing along your obviously not fully concentrating on the road and its not that uncommon for an accident to be caused by someone looking for a song or a radio station or even a dvd. maybe we should be aloud to use stuff in our vehicles but if we cause an accident due to lack of concentration you should get your licence taken away for a set time maybe that would make folk think more about what they are doing

 

[stuee147]

It's not the responsibility of pedestrians and others to make up for a vehicle's blind spots, that's the responsibility of the driver.

I have blind spots in my car and it's up to me to make sure before, for example, changing lanes, that there isn't another vehicle in my blind spot. I don't put the onus on others to keep out of that zone.

GC

in a way i have to agree it is mainly the responsibility of the driver but on the other hand i have driven lorry's and trying to compare the blind spots on a car to that of a lorry is silly. in a car you dont really have any blind spots if you move your head and neck. yet in a lorry the only possible way to see all the area is to climb out of the driving seat and lean out of the windows even then you wont be able to see behind you, not only that but the blind spot in a car might hide a bike but the only real way you wouldn't see another car is if you had a neck brace on and couldn't turn your head in which case you shouldn't be driving, yet in a lorry you can very very easily lose sight of a car and even a small van can be hidden. so unless you would expect a lorry driver to keep getting out of his seat and climbing over to the passengers side to hang out the window then i think it is the responsibility of all road users to think about not just what they are doing and where they are but also consider what other folk are doing and how there vehicles are going to move. its called common Curtsey and it makes the difference between a selfish twit on the road who is only concerned about themselves and there own journey and a happy road with folk thinking about others.

stuee