Rusty Nails
We remember
- Location
- Living in the slow lane
If you have a stand, or even stand the bike upside down, and turn the pedals, by looking carefully from the rear of the bike you can usually see if the disk is true or slightly out.
Replacing a wheelset…..
- Thread starter sevenfourate
- Start date
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If you have a stand, or even stand the bike upside down, and turn the pedals, by looking carefully from the rear of the bike you can usually see if the disk is true or slightly out.
OP
OP
sevenfourate
Devotee of OCD
- Location
- Lowestoft, Suffolk
I did it with bike upside down: and against a white sheet on the floor so I could see the gap between disc and pad clearly……
Yellow Saddle
Guru
- Location
- Loch side.
THAT'S the main issue. The spokes are mild steel and are rusty as. Some are quite thin where they cross over and touch / rub. I've had a few nipples break but it now seems maybe the threaded mild-steel ends are corroded / and hence smaller than designed; and seems a few spokes now won't stay tight (?). The bearings have not been touched to my knowledge since new (Bike is actually my sons and 12 (?) years old). Goodness knows if the cups are pitted as mentioned. If they've become 'dry' over time, got wet and sat.[Which it's bound to have done]: you'd absolutely not be shocked if they were......
Sprocket has of course done 12 years service - as have both discs. So for anything like £150 it would be good value to replace wheelset, sprocket and both brake discs.
On the other hand a brand new like-for-like replacement is £270......And likewise the labour / parts to rebuild new spokes and nipples into existing hubs / rims means that buying a new wheelset(Even of a lower quality like for like replacement) is likely cheaper than buying a complete wheelset.
Mad World at time........
You are of course welcome to buy new wheels for whatever reason you want to give.
However, some of your reasons need challenge just from a mythbusting point of view. I doubt mild steel spokes even exist. The cheapest are high-tensile, galvanised. The rest are all stainless. Spokes don't abrade from the touch/rub. There is no relative movement between spokes and thus no wear in that area. you've had some nipples break? Thjat doesn't sound plausible. I can see from here those are 14mm brass nipples. These don't break. Alu nipples do break if they are corroded and you attempt to turn them, but brass? Naaah!.
Sprockets and brakes don't age in years, they age in miles. I don't know how many miles you've done on that bike with those components but even if they are 50 years old and not ridden the distance, they will be fine.
Bearings? It is a simple test. Remove the wheel, grip the QR in one hand, spin the wheel and feel the bearings. They talk to you and tell you the condition, but rumbling or swhishing.
The perogative is yours, but i say, put the money in your pension pot. Or buy beer, but don't waste it on £114 wheels.
OP
OP
sevenfourate
Devotee of OCD
- Location
- Lowestoft, Suffolk
Just wow.
Mythbusting
Not plausable you say ? Nipples don't break ? Aluminium nipples only break if you attempt to adjust ? Mild steel spokes don’t exist ?You can only be insinuating I’ve pretty much made every part of this up.
Pics are all right here (Page 2) on my thread below. Both of the broken nipples and I think the rusted mild steel spokes.
https://www.cyclechat.net/threads/shuvs-2-wheeled-antics-slog.298781/page-2
Local Bike Shop said the nipples were Brass. Either way - and again; to mythbust as you put it - they broke whilst out riding (4 items on the last but one ride). Not while adjusting.
I could go on, but at this point I’ll just happily leave you to ‘it’…..
FrankCrank
Old layabout
I'd be very surprised if spokes, even on cheap shopping mall bikes, were sold with mild steel spokes. I've used many wheels with galvanised spokes, and leave till they're pretty rotten before upgrading to stainless ones, with brass nipples of course. Even in the close up shot in the other thread, I'm not seeing anything about the spokes themselves that would sound alarm bells if it was one of my bikes.
Rather than fan the flames on this one, I suspect a bad batch of spokes may be the root cause, but will remain a bit of a mystery I guess.
Rather than fan the flames on this one, I suspect a bad batch of spokes may be the root cause, but will remain a bit of a mystery I guess.
Jameshow
Veteran
He lives by the coast I believe so I wouldn't put anything past the rusting abilities of sea air!!
FrankCrank
Old layabout
Aha, yes, may well be a clue.
OP
OP
sevenfourate
Devotee of OCD
- Location
- Lowestoft, Suffolk
'He' is also General Manager of an Engineering Company specialising in manufacturing predominantly Mild Steel structures. And whilst not a qualified metallurgist: has worked with numerous grades of Mild steel for employment for over 25 years. A fair chunk of this for the offshore industry.
While i clearly haven't had the spokes tested; the corrosion is deep'ish at lacing cross-over points especially. And reasonably deeply pitted in other places. This doesn't look anything like a surface type covering in places from memory [I'm at work and cant back-up my thoughts or picture closely from here). This corrosion is 'in' and not 'on' however imo. And while i have often come across cheap / Chinese 'Stainless' Steel that has been afflicted by surface rust - these appear to be rusting at a much deeper level than surface alone. I also see no sign of any Silver underneath. From either Galvanised mild spokes. Or Stainless. They are now either Black from the original finish / paint. Or show rust.
Irrespective; rust can only be present if there is iron or iron alloys present. The environment i live in (Moist salt air yes; possibly) can only accelerate that. Not cause it in something with no iron content. So perhaps they are mild steel, perhaps the worst quality stainless steel you've ever come across - perhaps someone slipped the biggest load of rubbish you've ever seen into the smelting pot,or...............
FrankCrank
Old layabout
I'm certainly not a metallurgist either, but have some experience of stainless, used in a lot of my projects.
Stuff I use is regular 304, which is most likely what would be used for stainless spokes. This would suffer to a degree in any coastal area.
Marine grade stainless is 316, and suspect bike spokes would not be available in this grade.
My 'go to' test to see if something is stainless or not, is whether a fridge magnet sticks or not.. That said, there are some more exotic mixes of stainless where a magnet will indeed still stick, just to confuse things.
Carrera as a brand have a good reputation in general, the other Halford brand, Apollo, much less so.
The mystery deepens.
Stuff I use is regular 304, which is most likely what would be used for stainless spokes. This would suffer to a degree in any coastal area.
Marine grade stainless is 316, and suspect bike spokes would not be available in this grade.
My 'go to' test to see if something is stainless or not, is whether a fridge magnet sticks or not.. That said, there are some more exotic mixes of stainless where a magnet will indeed still stick, just to confuse things.
Carrera as a brand have a good reputation in general, the other Halford brand, Apollo, much less so.
The mystery deepens.
OP
OP
sevenfourate
Devotee of OCD
- Location
- Lowestoft, Suffolk
Oh we work a lot in Stainless too effectively. Just the majority is Mild. Also the use and supply of CE Certified A2 and A4 bolts / fixings to go with the stainless products accordingly.
I’ve just taken a few pics of what’s on the go in the workshop right now for interest 🤷♂️
First is ironically: some 316 Stainless and Mild Tanks being used for Phosphating (Corrosion protection) 🤣🤦♂️ of parts used primarily in an offshore environment:
A huge Stainless screw used in a Bio-energy plant:
Some 316 Grade material hoppers used in the pharmaceutical industry:
Some 316 grade trolleys used in a local Artisan dairy / cheese maker:
Some mild steel frames to support a 9ton Chiller at a Plastic Bottle producing Factory…..
Blah blah. We also work in copper, brass, titanium, aluminium and most things ‘metal’ or metal’ish. **Bit like my spokes with the latter 🤣🤣
FrankCrank
Old layabout
Now that's my kind of workshop. Yeah, forgot 316 also used in the food industry, and medical applications I expect.
