Quality v Cost?

[JPBoothy]

Hi All,
I have been a Cannondale fan for quite a while now and have currently got a CAADX which I tend to use as my 'go anywhere' trusty steed. However, it does have its limits, so I was toying with the idea of adding a road bike to my collection. I am a bit of a Dinosaur when it comes to my choice of frame material and still prefer Aluminium over Carbon, as I'd always be scared of crashing and breaking it. Stupid I know, but I can't get that thought out of my head

Anyway, yesterday I visited my local Evans Cycles store (Chester) to look at a CAAD12 Disc that they have on offer and was horrified at the poor finish of the internally routed hydraulic cables. There were no grommets to keep things neat and, I could literally rattle the cables around with my finger. On an actual ride it would drive me crazy!
Surely this can't be right on a bike that usually retails at almost £2k, especially on an established brand such as Cannondale, I asked the assistant, "yeah, it is the same on all of them" he replied.

Am I expecting too much for my money here, or was the assistant just a poor sales person? I am now thinking of looking for a (hardly) used CAAD 10 with cables on the outside as I'm not convinced that the casual rider needs discs anyway.

Any thoughts people

 

[fossyant]

I assume the holes in the frame are just holes.

If you are bothered a pack of 100 costs less than £10 from Farnell.

If the frame is internally routed then you wouldn't have any

 

[Drago]

What are you defnining as 'quality'. The things you cite are an annoyance for sure, but do not detract one jot from the bikes performance.

 

[vickster]

Steel as above, look for a new reduced Genesis equilibrium or lightly used second hand model

If still wanting Cannondale, Paul's cycles often have v good deals on older models

Or way less than 2k brings you to Ti territory

http://www.spacycles.co.uk/m1b0s21p3404/SABBATH-Aspire-105

http://www.spacycles.co.uk/m1b0s21p1995/SABBATH-Silk-Route

Spa own models inexpensive but as noted when I tried a couple, the finish on the welds etc reflects the price. Sabbath better (even though now owned by Spa)

 

[BurningLegs]

@vickster - blimey that is a lot of bike for the money! If I were in the market for a Ti bike I think I would jump at that

 

[JPBoothy]

Yes, I would have to do that rather than being driven crazy by the constant rattling. I wouldn't fancy trying to get the grommets around the hydraulic outer cable/pipe though. I believe that trying to replace them through a frame can be a right old faff even for a LBS.

I'm sure the quality of the frame is up to the usual high standards of Cannondale, but the lack of attention to the smaller details such as grommets can leave you wondering about what else has been missed/rushed.

I have a Steel single speed Genesis and the paint finish and welds are really nice. And it has even less cables to rattle too
If I have limited time for a ride the SS is just the job as small hills become mountains without gears.

Thanks everybody, your views are always appreciated.

 

[SpokeyDokey]

Yes, I would have to do that rather than being driven crazy by the constant rattling. I wouldn't fancy trying to get the grommets around the hydraulic outer cable/pipe though. I believe that trying to replace them through a frame can be a right old faff even for a LBS.

I'm sure the quality of the frame is up to the usual high standards of Cannondale, but the lack of attention to the smaller details such as grommets can leave you wondering about what else has been missed/rushed.

I have a Steel single speed Genesis and the paint finish and welds are really nice. And it has even less cables to rattle too
If I have limited time for a ride the SS is just the job as small hills become mountains without gears.

Thanks everybody, your views are always appreciated.

@JPBoothy

If that is indeed how they all are as per the sales assistants comment it is pathetic that they are produced like that.

Rattles are a PITA (there's enough threads on bike forums to attest to this) and internal cables just shouldn't rattle.

Different manufacturers solve this in different ways with eg foam tubing surrounding the hoses (cables should be taught and don't normally rattle), or the hose entry point has a clamp (Norco) or cable tie (Trek) that enables the hose to be kept taught within the tube.

It also helps where the entry/exit ports are eg if the hose enters at the top of the down tube and exits at the bottom then the hose is suspended in mid-air within the tube and, with a method of keeping it taut, it shouldn't rattle.

Also, excessively long hoses may not help if the excess is rammed into eg the down tube.

 

[Cycleops]

Another PITA might be the BB30 bottom bracket. With the rattling and creaking you might soon be reaching for a large bottle of paracetamol.

 

[JPBoothy]

I think I've been a lucky BB30 owner so far, as both of my CAADX's have only cost me a tenner each at the LBS to have them removed, cleaned and re-torqued at some point to rid them of that horrible noise that you mention.

A bloke at work has had loads of problems with his though. I believe that you can get some sort of a converter if you get totally fed-up with it?

 

[meadows]

Also to add to this post, I bought a carrera 3 years ago as just a commute bike to start getting into cycling. Yes it only has a 9 speed cassette and yes it weighs the same as a small car but I have used and abused the bike. However I only paid £125 for it and that included spd shoes and pedals (secondhand). Yet on my recent club ride I was riding front of a group consisting of wiler, bianchi's etc etc and many of them didnt keep up with me. My point is that people new to the sport think that buying a new much more expensive bike will solve all problems. When in fact the component of bike most important is the human body. So in therory for most average Joe riders such as myself frame material etc makes so little difference tbh when on their weekly club ride. Once milage etc and distance increases wieight and strength of materials do come into play for performance but again not everybody is inteded to ride up Mount Ventoux like chris froome so I conclude with a simple statement, pick a bike on whether you like the look if it or not because chances are that 95% of the bikes on the market will surfice the average weekend cyclist.

Sorry if this sounds a bit ranty not intended I promise

 

[Cycleops]

Also to add to this post, I bought a carrera 3 years ago as just a commute bike to start getting into cycling. Yes it only has a 9 speed cassette and yes it weighs the same as a small car but I have used and abused the bike. However I only paid £125 for it and that included spd shoes and pedals (secondhand). Yet on my recent club ride I was riding front of a group consisting of wiler, bianchi's etc etc and many of them didnt keep up with me.

Must have been the thumb tacks you keep dropping behind you.

 

[JPBoothy]

 oops sorry, I somehow managed to reply to Meadows 'rant' (only joking, they were all good points) without adding text first. I have deleted it now but apologies if you read it

I still rue the day when I sold my own 9spd road-bike as that would always keep me up with the racing snakes on their latest flavour of day machines. I totally agree with you that the person in the saddle makes the thing move not the fancy brand name and materials.

My 9spd was a flat-bar Aluminium Ribble framed mish mash of parts that was as quick as hell and never let me down. Hindsight eh

 

[bonzobanana]

I'm not sure I want to post this but many if not all Cannondales are made by fuji-ta of China. The largest bicycle manufacturer in the world, something like 17 million bicycles per year. I'm a big fan of this actual manufacturer but they cater for all customers high and low quality. Pacific cycles in the USA who own the Cannondale brand nowadays obviously dictate which components are fitted, frame geometry etc. I'm sure they are under huge pressure to maintain their perceived brand quality yet source as cheaply as possible. As if often the case you get quality fade, as the perception of the brand quality drops they have to drop prices to keep selling, a vicious circle. Maybe in ten years Walmart/Asda will have Cannondale as their exclusive shop brand. In the US many brands are under pressure to be direct sellers bypassing dealers altogether and that is another option. To summarise don't confuse the quality american made classic Cannondales with the chinese models. It's pretty clear you now perceive Cannondale as lower quality than they were, rightly so to be honest and that fits the reality of the situation exactly. I'd still buy a Cannondale myself but I would judge it on the components quality and price and the brand would be a bonus if Cannondale. I just wouldn't pay £1200 for a Cannondale when pretty much the same bike is available for £750 elsewhere.

You can watch their video here;


View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Yn5kIpIrv0

 

[bonzobanana]

Must have been the thumb tacks you keep dropping behind you.

I'm not a group cyclist myself but wondered how this would work. The person on the worst slowest bike has to work harder to keep up with the rest so you would think would lose weight faster and gain more fitness which may compensate for the heavier slower bike? The difference between an entry level road bike and higher end is about 4kg I guess (13kg to 9kg) however 4kg is easily lost from the human body. For the more casual cyclist who just enjoys a ride you just wonder if there is a rubber band effect where they merge together in equal ability overall. Also a stronger more comfortable bike may have benefits in how the rider feels when he cycles both physically and mentally. I'm more confident going fast downhill or on rough roads on a very strong bike with great brakes rather than a weak lightweight bike. Just curious.

 

[Cycleops]

I'm sure somebody could work out an equation for this.