Pompetamine Versa vs Day01 Alfine/Alfrat/Whatever?

[Shearwater]

So... I've decided to treat myself to a reasonably nice new bike, having been riding cheap things rescued from the deepest darkest 80s (via ebay) for the last 5 years or so. I only discovered surprisingly recently that there were hub gears somewhere between the SA 3-speed and a Rohlhoff, and the Alfine 8 speed looks ideal for me as I live in Flatland (East Anglia) and so the lack of hill-climbing ratios isn't a problem.

I'm keen to get something with an alfine, disc brakes, drop handlebars and largeish tires that can cope with tracks and towpaths and the like, and the above bikes look like they fit the bill nicely and are conveniently priced to be C2W-able.

Problem is, I have no idea how to tell if the £800 price tag on the Pompetamine is a sign of the other options being overpriced, or the on-one bike having ropey parts. All I've managed to learn so far is that the Day01's Tektro brakes have got some grumpy reviews (due to being awkward to adjust, and having one fixed pad) and there is at least one forum thread about them not playing nicely with the Shimano rotors the Day01 has fitted. On the other hand, the Pometamine doesn't seem to come with any pedals (and I don't have any lying around I'd want to put on it) and the tyres are relatively slick and thin compared to the Day01's (24 vs 35) which are more like the sort of things I'd want. Having to buy those rapidly eats up the price savings it offers. It might also be the case that the Pompetamine can't conveniently fit larger tyres with mudguards.

Can anyone cast any light on the subject? What do you get for the £1000 price of the Day01 apart from a fancy colour?

If there were any similar alternatives I should be looking at, I'd be keen to hear about those too.

Thanks in advance!

 

[RedBike]

Looking at the parts list of the On-one there's nothings ropey about the parts lists (main parts anyway).

There are several version of the Alfine hub. The 8speed is the older, less efficient version. I got to try one a few weeks ago. It changed very smoothly and there were no big jumps between the gears.
However, the lower gears (first), did feel rather inefficient like I was pedalling against a headwind. It also made the back of the bike feel very heavy.
The new Alfine 11 speed is supposed to be a lighter and more efficient in the lower ratios.

If there are no hills then it might be worth looking at single speed bikes? The weight advantage can more than makes up for the lack of gears.

 

[jack the lad]

I've got a flat bar Pompetamine. My (Shimano XT hydraulic) brakes are fantastic and one of the main reasons for getting the bike and going for the top flat bar model. They saved my life this morning when a postie pulled out on me on a steep hill, no fuss, no drama, but I can't comment on the drop bar version's brakes. Mine has 32mm tyres and I've fitted mudguards, no problem. It's a bit heavy but no worse than any other hybrid and so strong and stable I feel very confident both taking it off road and giving it some welly downhills (47 mph top so far!). Only real issue is that I found it overgeared (but I am old and like beer) so I've changed the chain ring from 48T to 44T, which has sorted it. It gets lots of admiring comments and lots of interest from other cyclists.

Generally On-ones seem to be 20-25% cheaper than the equivalent competition. Apart from selling direct so no retailer margins to cover, they also don't have a fixed spec on their bikes. The main bits stay the same, but if you go back and look again you'll often see that stems, bars, saddles, tyres etc. have changed. It's always good stuff for the price, but I guess they buy in job lots of overstock and end of lines at knockdown prices which helps keep prices down. If there is something you particularly wanted you just need to be careful it hasn't changed when you order - but they don't then change the spec for your bike once the order is placed.

Hope this helps.

 

[Howard]

I would hedge my bets that the Gen is lighter than the Pomp. It's Reynolds 531 (520) tubing IIRC.

If you are looking for alternatives you could try and get a Charge Mixer '10 in the sales - flat bars but you get hydraulics and they are very, very good. Has the clearance for CX and happily bounces around off-road. Tange Steel so a bit overweight but otherwise lovely.

 

[marcw]

I've got a Pomp Versa and it's great. I took off the crap seat it came with a put my Brooks and suspension post on and it's like riding a leather sofa but will the same responsive handling. Mine came with the 32mm Top Contacts, they don't look like 32s, more like 28. There isn't a noticable difference between my stiffer Alu Carbon with 25mm 100 PSI tyres and the Pomp with 32mm 80PSI tyres although I used to get wrist pain every so often and thats gone (even before I fitted the suspension post)

There isn't much of a difference in rolling speed between my two bikes although I think the Alu/Carbon is quicker. We're talking a minute or two on a 10 mile commute. I didn't have a rack on the AluCarbon and my average speed was about 1mph quicker on it.

The gearing on it is fine for me, did a ride around Epping forest and some of those hills are signposted as 20%. Taking it on the Exmoor Beast at the weekend. I don't notice the gearing jumps on my own but when riding with a friend I would have liked more gears. I found I was either pushing a slightly too high gear or spinning a slightly too low gear to hold his wheel. Was fine when I was controlling the pace but he had the GPS.

It's a little heavy compared to an Alu bike but nothing to write home about. Losing a few kilgrams is only worth the effort if you are racing.

The disc brakes work really well, especially if you have a loaded rack on. I'm much more confident that I'll actually stop when it's raining and it's very controlled. Having weight on the back wheel helps, I'm quite light and it was easy to lift the back wheel under heavy braking on my old bike. I've got the hub and rack & panniers keeping it down now so I can brake much harder on the front wheel. Even with the rack off it brakes better, it doesn't go spongy for a few seconds like braking with wet rims usually does.

I don't think there is much between the Pomp and the Day1 (not that I've ridden one). The Day1 is prettier (it doesn't have the horrible On One logos on it) but more expensive and they don't make them small enough for me to be comfortable. Someone commented on here that the Genesis bikes aren't very responsive, I can only say the Pomp is very stable and doesn't scare me at high speeds. It isn't as twitchy (possibly what other people call responsive) as my alu carbon and I prefer that even though the alu carbon was more exciting to ride. At times it felt like it wanted to chuck me off and run away.

The things I really like about it are the kind of things that don't jump out at you. There is less to clean, shifting stays smooth regardless if you've been down muddy paths, I don't get any back or wrist pain after long rides and I don't find myself suddenly thinking "why the **** am I not slowing down". Getting a rack on and off is easy and it will take a wide range of tyres. Have taken it through muddy tracks and was surprised at how well the Conti's gripped with only a little tread. Will get some cross tyres next spring for some weekend fun away from the roads. There is much more tyre clearance on the Pomp than the Day1.

 

[marcw]

I would hedge my bets that the Gen is lighter than the Pomp. It's Reynolds 531 (520) tubing IIRC.

If you are looking for alternatives you could try and get a Charge Mixer '10 in the sales - flat bars but you get hydraulics and they are very, very good. Has the clearance for CX and happily bounces around off-road. Tange Steel so a bit overweight but otherwise lovely.

The pomp is around 25llbs. The Genesis CDF was 24llbs with a derailleur and 725 tubing, I'd expect the Day one to be heavier than that but we're talking Mars bars rather than bags of suger.

 

[Shearwater]

There are several version of the Alfine hub. The 8speed is the older, less efficient version. I got to try one a few weeks ago. It changed very smoothly and there were no big jumps between the gears.
However, the lower gears (first), did feel rather inefficient like I was pedalling against a headwind. It also made the back of the bike feel very heavy.
The new Alfine 11 speed is supposed to be a lighter and more efficient in the lower ratios.

There's a certain amount of inconvenience associated with the 11-speed right now. The 8-speed has the handy (if distressingly expensive) versa shifters, for example. The 11 speed also adds up to a fair chunk of extra money which I don't totally feel would be well spent given that I won't benefit so much from having the wider range of gear ratios.

I have pondered getting a single speed bike and fitting the alfine 11 to it afterwards, but then I'm sorta stuffed by the fact that there are no suitable shifters for drop bars.

If there are no hills then it might be worth looking at single speed bikes? The weight advantage can more than makes up for the lack of gears.

Its not totally two-dimensional, just mostly. I've been using 7 and 10 speed bikes over the last few years and almost always use the top end but not exclusively. It would be nice to be able to take the bike a bit further afield to places where I probably couldn't just power up the hills on a single speed due to lack of fitness or having consumed too few pies to push the pedal down...

Generally On-ones seem to be 20-25% cheaper than the equivalent competition. Apart from selling direct so no retailer margins to cover, they also don't have a fixed spec on their bikes. The main bits stay the same, but if you go back and look again you'll often see that stems, bars, saddles, tyres etc. have changed. It's always good stuff for the price, but I guess they buy in job lots of overstock and end of lines at knockdown prices which helps keep prices down. If there is something you particularly wanted you just need to be careful it hasn't changed when you order - but they don't then change the spec for your bike once the order is placed.

Hope this helps.

That's good to know. I'm certainly leaning towards the on-one offering now... I guess if nothing else I won't really have lost anything by getting the cheaper bike and replacing a few bits; I can always pretend they're spares. Maybe the genesis or cotic bikes are slightly lighter, but I doubt they'd be lighter enough to make up my mind for me.

The key things I want (discs and hub) aren't likely to change a whole lot. I'm unlikely to notice or appreciate components or manufacturers changing, but I'd like to make sure that there weren't any obviously crap bits and that there wasn't any false economy going on by going after the cheaper bike.

 

[jack the lad]

What put me off the Cotic was that they haven't removed the v-brake bosses for disc brake versions. How naff is that! Full marks to Genesis on that score!

 

[marcw]

the alfine 11 is 1.6Kg and the 8 is 1.59Kg. I keep reading that it's lighter but it doesn't seem to pan out. I would go for an 11 with closer ratios if it wasn't double the price of the 8. Might try oil in the 8 once the warrenty has run out and 11s are cheaper should I reck it.

 

[Shearwater]

The disc brakes work really well, especially if you have a loaded rack on. I'm much more confident that I'll actually stop when it's raining and it's very controlled. Having weight on the back wheel helps, I'm quite light and it was easy to lift the back wheel under heavy braking on my old bike. I've got the hub and rack & panniers keeping it down now so I can brake much harder on the front wheel. Even with the rack off it brakes better, it doesn't go spongy for a few seconds like braking with wet rims usually does.

This is why I'm looking at discs... I've had a couple of unpleasant experiences in the rain, and this isn't intended to be a fair weather bike. Hard to say whether it is necessarily the right decision (there are lots of people elsewhere who basically chalk up disc use to following fashion trends, something which totally disinterests me!) but I'm reasonably certain its the way to go. I've spent much less time on discs than conventional brake bikes though.

I don't think there is much between the Pomp and the Day1 (not that I've ridden one). The Day1 is prettier (it doesn't have the horrible On One logos on it) but more expensive and they don't make them small enough for me to be comfortable. Someone commented on here that the Genesis bikes aren't very responsive, I can only say the Pomp is very stable and doesn't scare me at high speeds. It isn't as twitchy (possibly what other people call responsive) as my alu carbon and I prefer that even though the alu carbon was more exciting to ride. At times it felt like it wanted to chuck me off and run away.

High speeds have always alarmed me. I have a very vivid imagination, a firm grasp of physics and a rudimentary knowledge of human biology, none of which help matters. I'm unlikely to exceed 30mph under normal use ;-) I can't say I've ever really noticed any nuances in the feel of a bike or its stability, but maybe that's just because all the bikes I've ever ridden are basically the same.

The things I really like about it are the kind of things that don't jump out at you. There is less to clean, shifting stays smooth regardless if you've been down muddy paths, I don't get any back or wrist pain after long rides and I don't find myself suddenly thinking "why the **** am I not slowing down". Getting a rack on and off is easy and it will take a wide range of tyres. Have taken it through muddy tracks and was surprised at how well the Conti's gripped with only a little tread. Will get some cross tyres next spring for some weekend fun away from the roads. There is much more tyre clearance on the Pomp than the Day1.

Excellent stuff. I'm largely sold, on the whole 'its perfectly adequate' and the 'its 200 quid cheaper' arguments. I wonder if anyone has anything grumpy to say about the Pompetamine... I've not come across negative comments yet but its pretty early days.

Thanks for your input!

 

[Shearwater]

What put me off the Cotic was that they haven't removed the v-brake bosses for disc brake versions. How naff is that! Full marks to Genesis on that score!

That doesn't sound like such a bad thing... surely it doesn't add any noticeable weight or inconvenience, and it makes the frame slightly more versatile in the future? Don't think the presence of v-brake mounts would particularly irritate me.

 

[jack the lad]

That doesn't sound like such a bad thing... surely it doesn't add any noticeable weight or inconvenience, and it makes the frame slightly more versatile in the future? Don't think the presence of v-brake mounts would particularly irritate me.

I'm just shallow...Style matters. On-One seems to be a 'cool' brand too, my kids approve, loads of strangers want to talk to me about my bike and, as an added bonus, they are 'Made in Yorkshire' (albeit from imported parts).

 

[vorsprung]

Latest blog entry is on my Alfine Roadrat. I'm been riding it since last winter

 

[Howard]

Latest blog entry is on my Alfine Roadrat. I'm been riding it since last winter

It's all seatpost!

Kidding. It's very nice. Did you build the wheels? If so what (rear) rim did you go for, and how did you calculate the (rear) spoke lengths?

 

[GrumpyGregry]

jtek make drop bar shifters for alfine, it's a bar end type jobbie so not everyone's cup of tea but works a treat.