Oh Boris! You do surprise me......

[another_dave_b]

If all the boroughs aren't on board for the cycle hire scheme then it will be difficult to administer. What happens if someone rides out from central London to a borough not in the scheme? Where do they leave the bike? How will it be retrieved?

Presumably returning the bike would be the responsibility of the hirer, so they'd return it to the nearest point to their journey's end.

I would imagine the train stations into London would be the biggest drop/hire points in any such scheme, with commuters/tourists hiring bikes.

EDIT
Come to think of it, I don't see why a bicycle hire scheme would require the involvement of the various London boroughs. I think the Paris scheme is run by an advertising company.

 

[dellzeqq]

Come to think of it, I don't see why a bicycle hire scheme would require the involvement of the various London boroughs. I think the Paris scheme is run by an advertising company.

you're right - the Paris scheme is run by the company that makes bus shelters and street furniture (whose name escapes me). But...the Mairie made space available. In Paris the mayor snaps his fingers and it happens. Ken could make space available on TfL roads, but these are a small minority. The Boroughs control the great majority. So Brent, a Borough that only fifteen months ago was insisting on 1500 car spaces on a 1000 dwelling residential scheme in Colindale - right by the Edgware Road - decided it had no space for the bike points.

In fairness, there was a point last year when Ken was talking about confining the scheme to the Circle Line area and moving outward - but that was going to be financed by the 4x4 tax, now dead and buried. And, even then, Westminster wasn't up for it.

 

[DJ]

I'm sure your right, but your point must be, that the idea of a London Cycle Route Network has gone out of control.

When I used it, when it was just a map, it was just a way to plan long, cross town journeys. A bicycle version of an inner ring road, but using B roads. Journeys would start and end using ordinary roads.

Now it seems to be an attempt at a duplicate road network.

I use the current set of maps that are given away free from TFL which haver a variety of different routes printed on them from designated cycle paths to routes reccomended by other cyclists, routes through parks etc, what they have landed up with is a map of London completlewy criss crossed with a very confusing but varied net work, I think they are just trying to give as many options as possible, the maps do work and I have been able to plan little cut through's and the like which I wouldn't have otherwise known about.
Now the down side, as what I think Delzeg is getting at is that some of the supposedly reccomended routes by other cyclists are just awful, negotiating kerbs, bollards, speed humps, not to mention ped's who reccomended these routes I have no idea it might have been a kid on an MTB, and how can serious cyclists be taken seriously by others when at one point they are steaming down the road with the traffic and the next they are using pelican crossings and going over pavements? For the commuter who needs a quick safe route to and from work the main arterial routes do not need any more investment other than more paint and more education for car drivers, Delzegg is right by scrapping the plans for the western congestion zone Boris has once again, alienated cyclists, all Boris does is posture on his bicycle for the cameras, in order to win the what is a major vote.!!! I did'nt vote for the fat tory twat in the first place.

 

[another_dave_b]

I use the current set of maps that are given away free from TFL which haver a variety of different routes printed on them from designated cycle paths to routes reccomended by other cyclists, routes through parks etc, what they have landed up with is a map of London completlewy criss crossed with a very confusing but varied net work, I think they are just trying to give as many options as possible, the maps do work and I have been able to plan little cut through's and the like which I wouldn't have otherwise known about.
Now the down side, as what I think Delzeg is getting at is that some of the supposedly reccomended routes by other cyclists are just awful, negotiating kerbs, bollards, speed humps, not to mention ped's who reccomended these routes I have no idea it might have been a kid on an MTB, and how can serious cyclists be taken seriously by others when at one point they are steaming down the road with the traffic and the next they are using pelican crossings and going over pavements? For the commuter who needs a quick safe route to and from work the main arterial routes do not need any more investment other than more paint and more education for car drivers, Delzegg is right by scrapping the plans for the western congestion zone Boris has once again, alienated cyclists, all Boris does is posture on his bicycle for the cameras, in order to win the what is a major vote.!!! I did'nt vote for the fat tory twat in the first place.

If you make a cross-town journey in a car, you tend to follow the A roads. Cross town road signs direct your journey, maps highlight A roads, and they're wider and faster.

I'd always thought of the original cycle route network, as the same sort of thing for bikes, just using low traffic B roads.

I think the main reason you see so many cyclists on the A roads, is probably because they don't know a route, so they're just following the road signs.

I think the key point in Mr Johnson's 'super highways' thing, is the proposed signage: "My proposals for cycle highways will provide safe and continuous routes for cyclists"

That said, I don't live in London these days, so I'm way out of date on the London cycling experience.

 

[CotterPin]

who reccomended these routes I have no idea it might have been a kid on an MTB,

I have always been of the opinion that the London Cycle Network was dreamed up by a bunch of cyclists (possibly couriers) who were trying to figure out ways of getting around London that would avoid the busier and more congested roads. Somewhere along the way it morphed into a policy that became the only show in town. It reminds us of that we need to beware of what we wish because it may come true!

I think the key point in Mr Johnson's 'super highways' thing, is the proposed signage: "My proposals for cycle highways will provide safe and continuous routes for cyclists"

Unfortunately I am not a 100% convinced (or even 0.001% convinced) that they will be continuous when Johnson discovers that they will interfere with the free flow of motor traffic

 

[tdr1nka]

The real problem is that the major routes in London are quite often the quickest and safest overall.
To take side streets can also send you down roads with cars parked down both sides, nil visibility at junctions and leaving you at the mercy of WVM and 4x4 school runners who also use these roads as rat runs.

There was talk of the Highway Code near insisting that cyclists stick to cycle routes and paths as much as possible to keep us out of traffic harm.
Thankfully it was dropped for the folly it was.
Had this actually come into force I would have 'technically' been able to cycle no further than 300 yards from my own front door. Utter bilge.

Those in power know that they should recognise cycling, the problem is that they seem only capable to recognising cycling from the point of view of the motoring lobby.

 

[dellzeqq]

One of these days the story of the CTC's dark deeds on the Highway Code will be told. Put simply they were in a position to blackmail the government into changing tack. Which they did. To their eternal credit.

 

[skrx]

I use the major roads in London if:
* I don't know a better route (i.e. I've got lost, and forgot a map, and have resorted to remembering where "famous" roads go or following signs)
* It's night (saves using a squiggly route)
* The route has a bus lane (a.k.a. decent width cycle lane?)

The things that most annoy me as a recent convert to cycling (6 weeks) are:
* One way streets -- they mess up carefully memorised routes, and complicate going home again. They're intended to cut congestion, bikes don't cause congestion. I ignore them whenever it's safe to do so.
* Parked cars. That road space is too valuable to be used by one person.
* Squiggly routes. In Copenhagen (apparently), the most direct route is almost always best by bike, cars get the roundabout route.
I wrote to my London Assembly member (the one for Wandsworth and Merton, he's on the transport committee), I haven't yet had a reply (but it's not been very long).