New car disaster!

[Dogtrousers]

Common sense ... But how many drivers with high performance vehicles actually use it , very few, otherwise they wouldn't have bought the vehicle in the first place,

Excellent point.

 

[grldtnr]

Excellent point.

Commonsense is a standard safety system fitted at birth in all drivers, rarely used and often deleted !
As in all things, the simplest work the best, don't you think!

 

[SpokeyDokey]

While I agree, I think the problem really is that people don't want those interventions. Most are pretty passive systems, warning but not actually intervening and can easily be ignored. I'd have thought a good majority of cars on the road (say cars post 2015) will have some systems already...but the amount of speeding drivers out there belie the systems effectiveness.

In short, if people want to ignore...its pointless,and clearly a LOT of people disregard their own, let alone others safety.

Personally, the only one on my 2018 Mazda that influences me is speed warnings which I use constantly. it saves looking at the speedo, keeps eyes on the road.
Sadly unless they make the systems active and not possible to override, its pretty mute for a lot of people.

Would I want such intervention ?, .... it perhaps wouldn't bother me too much but I'm a pretty steady driver. Seems I'm in a minority a lot of the time...

I think that some of the 'passive' systems eg ESC, work far more than many drivers realise.

I am a fan of almost all the new tech' on cars. They are far safer vehicles these days, hence the proliferation of 4 & 5 star NCAP ratings on even relatively mundane cars.

The only irritating one on our car is the lane departure warning when on twisty lanes with central road markings. It is easily deactivated though.

People, especially as we get older, often resist change quite forcibly.

No doubt our forebears resisted radial-ply tyres, seat belts, laminated windscreens, heaters, headrests, ABS, PAS, servo-assisted brakes, etc.

 

[grldtnr]

I think that some of the 'passive' systems eg ESC, work far more than many drivers realise.

I am a fan of almost all the new tech' on cars. They are far safer vehicles these days, hence the proliferation of 4 & 5 star NCAP ratings on even relatively mundane cars.

The only irritating one on our car is the lane departure warning when on twisty lanes with central road markings. It is easily deactivated though.

People, especially as we get older, often resist change quite forcibly.

No doubt our forebears resisted radial-ply tyres, seat belts, laminated windscreens, heaters, headrests, ABS, PAS, servo-assisted brakes, etc.

And there lies the problem ',easily deactivated'.
I have stop /start on my car, it's very frustrating to me, I cannot easily delete it, just deactivate it,vits a feature I rarely use, but being a 10 yr old car, it's free of all the other aggravating safety features, but still has passive ones like ABS and traction control , which I could deactivate, but don't.
The Stop/ start does delay the driveability a bit, and also it encourages the use of the footbrake to be used for short stoppages, being an Automatic, a wet boot can slip off, then engages drive,not the best thing,bits also more tiring to have to keep your feet on the brake/ clutch , if you have a manual, the other thing is the rear brake lights are active, causing night vision problems.
I just knock into neutral and put the handbrake on if in heavy traffic, far safer!

 

[biggs682]

On our Note we have cruise control which I use loads and we have the speed limit option FFS it's a Nissan note

 

[SpokeyDokey]

And there lies the problem ',easily deactivated'.

Why is that a problem?

The availibilty of manual deactivation is important on lane departure warning systems. It excels at warning of lane drift, or failure to indicate, on major carriageways - its primary design function.

But, on tight twisty lanes, such as here in the Lake District, it can be over-zealous and can become a real distraction. This is simply a function of how the radar system works.

I know that lane departure warning uses GPS, radar, lidar, etc but as AFAIK the on/off function is not linked to GPS location in any production car. I could well be wrong here.

***

I like the engine stop/start function in our manual car. It is very unobtrusive, almost to the point of me being unaware that it is functioning at all.

 

[grldtnr]

Why is that a problem?

The availibilty of manual deactivation is important on lane departure warning systems. It excels at warning of lane drift, or failure to indicate, on major carriageways - its primary design function.

But, on tight twisty lanes, such as here in the Lake District, it can be over-zealous and can become a real distraction. This is simply a function of how the radar system works.

I know that lane departure warning uses GPS, radar, lidar, etc but as AFAIK the on/off function is not linked to GPS location in any production car. I could well be wrong here.

***

I like the engine stop/start function in our manual car. It is very unobtrusive, almost to the point of me being unaware that it is functioning at all.

I'm with Drago on this , we should rely on our attentiveness when driving, if you are missing minor things like road positioning ,then you shouldn't be driving.
Systems fail ,even fail systems, to over rely on driving aids is a complete fallacy

 

[Alex321]

On our Note we have cruise control which I use loads and we have the speed limit option FFS it's a Nissan note

Why "FFS it's a Nissan Note"?

There isn't a reasonably modern car on the road that will not easily exceed urban speed limits, and even a Note will still easily do more than 70mph.

I used to use cruise control, but have switched to using the speed limiter almost all the time now, particularly in the 20 & 30 limits round here. It isn't ideal on my car, because you don't need to boot it to override, you only need slightly more pressure on the throttle than you would normally use to maintain speed. On my wife's Micra, you do have to really boot it, and I think that is much better.

 

[Dadam]

I have stop /start on my car, it's very frustrating to me, I cannot easily delete it, just deactivate it,vits a feature I rarely use, but being a 10 yr old car, it's free of all the other aggravating safety features, but still has passive ones like ABS and traction control , which I could deactivate, but don't.
The Stop/ start does delay the driveability a bit, and also it encourages the use of the footbrake to be used for short stoppages, being an Automatic, a wet boot can slip off, then engages drive,not the best thing,bits also more tiring to have to keep your feet on the brake/ clutch , if you have a manual, the other thing is the rear brake lights are active, causing night vision problems.

I like the stop/start on my car, it's saving fuel. I don't know about your car but on mine it adds zero delay. Take foot off brake and engine is running before foot is on accelerator.
Put the handbrake on if worried about feet slipping off the brake. Too tiring to keep foot on brake! If you're stopping for that long you should put it in Park and turn the engine off!

I just knock into neutral and put the handbrake on if in heavy traffic, far safer!

Then you're increasing pollution and wasting fuel, and contravening the spirit if not the letter of Rule 123 by leaving engine running unnecessarily.

Rule 123​

The driver and the environment. You MUST NOT leave a parked vehicle unattended with the engine running or leave a vehicle engine running unnecessarily while that vehicle is stationary on a public road.
Generally, if the vehicle is stationary and is likely to remain so for more than a couple of minutes, you should apply the parking brake and switch off the engine to reduce emissions and noise pollution

 

[SpokeyDokey]

we should rely on our attentiveness when driving, if you are missing minor things like road positioning ,then you shouldn't be driving.

This is where I differ.

It is very easy to state what should be the perfect state of mind to drive a car. However, the reality is very different.

Humans are, well... human and, as such, do human things without conscious thought. They can be easily distracted via reflex reactions to sound etc. Minds 'wander' whilst dealing with the nitty-gritty of life. Blah, blah, blah.

Almost 100% of the time these things have little effect on driving performance but... now & again, they will cause driving errors that may have serious consequences. And this is where automatic safety systems earn their keep as it were.

It is simply impossible for any driver to have 100% attention on their driving, without any other thought or reflex response occasionally occurring. They may drive with that intent for sure but the reality is very different. Humans continually monitor and react to the totality of what is happening around them. It's why a snooker player is notionally 100% focused on their shot, but nonetheless responds to a cough by an audience member.

As a further example; whilst driving, a low flying jet fighter passes overhead (happens occasionally where we live) and the reflex action is to look, and maybe flinch, these being the standard human responses to unexpected loud noise and motion.

For a short period of time you do not have 100% attention on your driving and, just maybe in an unfortunate juxtaposition of circumstances, lane departure warning or crash avoidance systems etc may save lives.

 

[grldtnr]

I like the stop/start on my car, it's saving fuel. I don't know about your car but on mine it adds zero delay. Take foot off brake and engine is running before foot is on accelerator.
Put the handbrake on if worried about feet slipping off the brake. Too tiring to keep foot on brake! If you're stopping for that long you should put it in Park and turn the engine off!



Then you're increasing pollution and wasting fuel, and contravening the spirit if not the letter of Rule 123 by leaving engine running unnecessarily.

Exactly what I do! But then I rarely drive in town or heavy traffic , not a problem.

 

[gbb]

And there lies the problem ',easily deactivated'.
I have stop /start on my car, it's very frustrating to me, I cannot easily delete it, just deactivate it,vits a feature I rarely use, but being a 10 yr old car, it's free of all the other aggravating safety features, but still has passive ones like ABS and traction control , which I could deactivate, but don't.
The Stop/ start does delay the driveability a bit, and also it encourages the use of the footbrake to be used for short stoppages, being an Automatic, a wet boot can slip off, then engages drive,not the best thing,bits also more tiring to have to keep your feet on the brake/ clutch , if you have a manual, the other thing is the rear brake lights are active, causing night vision problems.
I just knock into neutral and put the handbrake on if in heavy traffic, far safer!

Certainly on the Mazda, if you have windscreen demist activated, start stop doesn't activate. There will be other parameters as well that dictate if its activated or not. I just turn on demist and set the fan to the lowesr it will go

 

[Dogtrousers]

I'd love to have these gizmos and automation.

But my little 10yo car just sailed through its MoT and I've just put new tyres on it, so I expect it to last me a good few years yet. Hopefully by the time it dies there will be second hand leccy cars with super duper safety wotnots available. I've never bought a new car and I can't see that changing.

Although one worry is that everything would break. I'd desperately want to give the windscreen a squirt and put the wipers on to dislodge a bit of bird poo and the system would be saying "nope, squirting and wiping function unavailable".

 

[Alex321]

Certainly on the Mazda, if you have windscreen demist activated, start stop doesn't activate. There will be other parameters as well that dictate if its activated or not. I just turn on demist and set the fan to the lowesr it will go

Yes, tere are quite a few things that prevent it activating on most cars.

I didn't even know my car had it for four years after buying it (2nd hand). Once I kew it had it, after it had activeted to my surprise on one journey, I looked it up. Mine (Vauxhall Insignia 2015) won't activate if you have the air con turned on, or if you have the front screen demist turned on, or if the engine hasn't reached steady engine temperature, or if you have just come off a motorway or similar, or if the battery is not fully charged, or a few other things.

You don't need to keep your foot on the brake to keep it stopped though, when it does activate. Just leave it in neutral and at a standstill (preferably with handbrake on, but that is not necessary for operation). Depressing the clutch starts the engine then.

 

[biggs682]

Why "FFS it's a Nissan Note"?

There isn't a reasonably modern car on the road that will not easily exceed urban speed limits, and even a Note will still easily do more than 70mph.

I used to use cruise control, but have switched to using the speed limiter almost all the time now, particularly in the 20 & 30 limits round here. It isn't ideal on my car, because you don't need to boot it to override, you only need slightly more pressure on the throttle than you would normally use to maintain speed. On my wife's Micra, you do have to really boot it, and I think that is much better.

No real reason why FFS

I limit myself to 65 mph where conditions allow as the Nissan note has an image to live up to .

But as we all know that is still more than quick enough to get into trouble .