metro article on helmets

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There are some interesting points in there. Exposure time being one that caught my eye. As far as I understand it the comparison between Peds and cyclists has been made in these threads in kilometres travelled. I have pointed out before the time factor , unfortunately other than gaz nobody could grasp the difference including the usual suspects on this thread. Now I wonder why that could be ? Could it be that it would actualy indicate that cycling would be potentialy more hazardous than travelling by foot ?

More questions I know, but hey, you guys like answers. So I'm expecting no shortage of them.

The difference is "grasped, but when quoting a paper such as Wardlaw in the BMJ, you can really only quote their work. Hence the reason milage is quoted.

The real problem is defining what is "fair" when comparing two groups. Cycling may be more dangerous if you consider time rather than distance, but is it the correct comparison?

Lets compare an person going to the shops on a "sit up and beg" and a racing cyclist going to the same set of shops from teh same starting point.

The distance is the same, so is the "exposure" if we use this as the measure.

If we then look at the time the racing cyclists will complete the distance in half of the time the shopper does, and therefore has less "exposure"

Does that make cycling slowly more dangerous?


It all depends on what you feel to be the correct one.

As with the one petrolhead group proving just how dangerous cyclists are to pedestrians.

If you take the number of pedestrians killed each year by motorists and by cyclists then the numbers demonstrate that vehicles kill many more than cyclists. However this group then corrected the figures for distance and quoted deaths per mile driven / cycled

They "proved" unequivocally that cyclists kill many more people per mile than vehicles and are a bigger danger to pedestrians than motor vehicles.!
 

lukesdad

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So to sum up that post Cunobelin, which is the more dangerous depends on personal interpretation ?
 
The difficulty is that there is no unequivocal method of estimating the exposure, or risk.

Risk and exposure will always however be an individual description.

Take three cyclists at the same speed on the same machines. One has been trained, one had fifty years experience on the roads and the other is a novice who has just picked up the machine from the shop.

No matter what method you use to measure their exposure, the reality is that they will be differently "at risk" for the same "exposure"
 

lukesdad

Guest
1810398 said:
Apologies if that is how it is, unfortunately from where I'm sitting it comes over as you who is trying to be clever here.

Not at all Adrian, go back to the question to ben. Then to allotment mans reply then, on to bens reply. There's no trickery.

Perhaps Cunobelin can shed some light on my original questions ? As you and red light seem either unwilling or unable to answer them.
 
FFS its got nothing to do with not being in favour of helmets. As you well know I only wear a helmet mtbing, that leaves between 6000 and 10 000 miles anually when I don't.

So you keep claiming. Your posting history in helmet threads says otherwise.

I asked some simple questions, the allotment man decided he try and get clever, then ( except for ben to his credit) you and Adrian decided you'd follow suit. This seems to be a reoccuring factor in most helmet debate threads, that is of course untill you start to ridicule some poor misfortunate who stumbles in, unaware of the ambush awaiting.

Ah yes, Robin Hood's Dad, saving the poor misfortunates from those dastardly people that want them to stop them proselytising helmet wearing.
 

lukesdad

Guest
1810427 said:
Leaving aside the difficulty of measuring it accurately to the nth degree, we do all know that cycling, walking, travelling by car, not to mention every other day to day activity, all carry a small risk of acquiring a head injury per hour or per kilometer. Why is it that cycling is the one singled out for the pressure, back-door compulsion etc to wear a helmet?

Wait your turn with the questions willya ^_^

But in answer to your question, I do have my suspiscions and they re nothing to do with safety.
 
Perhaps Cunobelin can shed some light on my original questions ? As you and red light seem either unwilling or unable to answer them.

And you seem either unable or unwilling to do some research for yourself preferring to get others to do it for you and then rubbish it.
 
I'm beginning to find that helmet debates make my head hurt ....

If you took the trouble to read the facts (that I selected from bollocksfacts.com) you'd see that helmet debates in fact do not make your head hurt.

You just made the lazy assumption because you get a headache when you read this thread.

Are you even a so-called healthcare 'professional'?

Is pasta one of my five a day?

How many fish make twelve?

Why is a beagle?

Now I have a headache too..... Bloody helmet debates! :angry:
 

lukesdad

Guest
So you keep claiming. Your posting history in helmet threads says otherwise.



Ah yes, Robin Hood's Dad, saving the poor misfortunates from those dastardly people that want them to stop them proselytising helmet wearing.

Well you like evidence and seeing as you are such an expert on my posting history, have a scan through the CC rides there are plenty of pics of me in cycling attire.

My posting history in helmet threads as once again you well know is questioning dodgy evidence.

Now stop playing to the crowd, and get answering the questions.
 

Fab Foodie

hanging-on in quiet desperation ...
Location
Kirton, Devon.
If you took the trouble to read the facts (that I selected from bollocksfacts.com) you'd see that helmet debates in fact do not make your head hurt.

You just made the lazy assumption because you get a headache when you read this thread.

Are you even a so-called healthcare 'professional'?

Is pasta one of my five a day?

How many fish make twelve?

Why is a beagle?

Now I have a headache too..... Bloody helmet debates! :angry:

I'll come back to you when I've looked-up the answer to the fish question.
 

lukesdad

Guest
And you seem either unable or unwilling to do some research for yourself preferring to get others to do it for you and then rubbish it.

Why should I ? I'm not supplying the statements, and if by rubbishing it you mean asking uncomfortable questions. Well thats the nature of the beast, when you start making sweeping statements.
 

lukesdad

Guest
.....and I'll comeback in 3 months to see if my questions have been answered, do ya geddit yet ? ^_^

meanwhile play nice, and remember everybody entering these debates might not be as informed as yourselves.

I ll be watching tara ! :thumbsup:
 
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