London to Paris Charity Ride

[SimonRoberts0204]

That Raleigh you mentioned - the 100 , is it the Airlite 100 road bike?

I thought they were going for 250 as a fairly standard price?

 

[blazed]

In my experience, knowledgeable and experienced cyclists will go for the best bargain, whether it be on the web or in LBS.
Regular people go to LBS so LBS man can get the thing from box to road in a safe condition.
Really regular people go to LBS and simply pay the 'sticker price' on the card tag. No haggling or asking for discount. This is how LBSs make a better living.

What you get when you buy from LBS is somewhere to take it when you've messed up the gear adjustments.

Some Really Regular people buy from LBS so they have someone who can fix their punctures.

Yep and 90% of those get ripped off.

Halfords FTW.

 

[jimboalee]

Yep and 90% of those get ripped off.

Halfords FTW.

The other type worth mentioning is the chap who buys from the Specialized Concept Store to show everyone he's got money to burn.

 

[skwerl]

Yes he got a discount, it started off £120 more than the cheapest internet price and ended up £90 more. He did get a free service though.

I see the same thing in all the small bike shops ive been to, way over priced bikes and thats a fact. Little bike shops cant match the prices of the larger ones simply because they do not order in enough stock to get the same discounts. You may have been lucky, maybe the guy you brought from was happy to sell the bike at no profit for whatever reason that day. But the huge majority of people who buy from local shops are paying way, way more than they would online.

Bare in mind the majority of people buying from them are not bike nuts with a lot of knowledge on them they are just regular people who basically get mugged.

What the LBS gets you is advise. A lot of people want to buy a bike but don't know where to start. An LBS allows you to ask for advice and try different bikes - not something t'internet can do. LBSs also have higher costs than internet firms so they need to recover those. I guess you think the owners all laugh their asses off as they drive home in their gold-plated Ferraris thinking about all the porr sods they've 'mugged'?

 

[blazed]

What the LBS gets you is advise. A lot of people want to buy a bike but don't know where to start. An LBS allows you to ask for advice and try different bikes - not something t'internet can do. LBSs also have higher costs than internet firms so they need to recover those. I guess you think the owners all laugh their asses off as they drive home in their gold-plated Ferraris thinking about all the porr sods they've 'mugged'?

They dont have higher costs, not unless the internet sites are just drop shipping but thats usually just the small sites that do that, the rest have warehouses with staff pickng and dispatching items all day and costs are higher im sure than running a tiny little shop with a few bikes in it. Not to mention they also have the cost of running and maintaining a busy website, programmer costs etc are not cheap.

Best way to do it is if your local shop have a lot of stock go down try a few bikes to see if they fit, then order it online.

 

[Swanny]

Re post 16

Yes thats the one.

 

[skwerl]

They dont have higher costs, not unless the internet sites are just drop shipping but thats usually just the small sites that do that, the rest have warehouses with staff pickng and dispatching items all day and costs are higher im sure than running a tiny little shop with a few bikes in it. Not to mention they also have the cost of running and maintaining a busy website, programmer costs etc are not cheap.

you clearly don't understand the concept of economies of scale. And you think a high-street retail unit costs the same per sq ft as a warehouse on some arse-end industrial site?

Best way to do it is if your local shop have a lot of stock go down try a few bikes to see if they fit, then order it online.

Yep. Sure fire way of ensuring they go out of business. Once your LBS closes down where are you going to go to try before you buy online?

 

[ASC1951]

Best way to do it is if your local shop have a lot of stock go down try a few bikes to see if they fit, then order it online.

Yes, another one who "knows the price of everything and the value of nothing".

You selfish self-gratification artist.

 

[blazed]

you clearly don't understand the concept of economies of scale. And you think a high-street retail unit costs the same per sq ft as a warehouse on some arse-end industrial site?



Yep. Sure fire way of ensuring they go out of business. Once your LBS closes down where are you going to go to try before you buy online?

The small shop has that one building to pay for, the large online retailer has a warehouse, office, and website as well as employees in the warehouse, in the office and maintaining the website. You were suggesting LBS prices were so high because they have higher costs which is completely incorrect. They are high because they are crummy little shops that never expanded and now cant compete with the big boys.

Yes, another one who "knows the price of everything and the value of nothing".

You selfish self-gratification artist.

 

[Sittingduck]

The small shop has that one building to pay for, the large online retailer has a warehouse, office, and website as well as employees in the warehouse, in the office and maintaining the website.

The shops are normally over more than 1 level and in city centre (expensive) locations for ground rent. The larger warehouses arer out in the middle of an industrial estate somewhere. Go figure.

 

[Tynan]

Who would have thought that LBS would be the new helmets argument

The people on here asking terrible questions have usually bought a bike from either a website or Halfords which might as well be a website (or a bad LBS)

For the margin an LBS might charge you're getting an experienced and knowledgeable opinion as well as support for that crucial 'why is the back tyre flat' period

It's whatever works for any given person, slagging off bike shops strikes me as incredibly ignorant, it's like slagging off small shops because supermarkets are bestest

 

[skwerl]

The small shop has that one building to pay for, the large online retailer has a warehouse, office, and website as well as employees in the warehouse, in the office and maintaining the website. You were suggesting LBS prices were so high because they have higher costs which is completely incorrect. They are high because they are crummy little shops that never expanded and now cant compete with the big boys.

and I repeat. You clearly know nothing about economies of scale.

You really think the warehouse people pay the same per-unit price for the thousands of bikes they buy as the LBS guy that buys a couple of dozen? You don't think the manufacturers give the big suppliers sale or return deals or incentive packages?

Warehouse staff cost? They're low-skilled, out-of-town labour, i.e. cheap. Website - yes, they cost but the support cost per sale will be very small.

Try working out the operating cost per unit sold and compare an LBS and a warehouse outfit. Do you really think an LBS charges more because he can 'get away with it' and likes to mug customers?

Who needs repeat custom more? Internet-based or LBS?

You seem to think that crummy little shops really shouldn't exist and that all our shopping should either be done on the internet or at large superstores. You really don't see any benefit of local suppliers do you? Ever bought something from an LBS? I bet you have because you needed it quick or didn't want to pay 100% P&P for an inner tube or puncture repair kit.

For some research. Take a look at Condor Cycles. An LBS that's been on the go for 60 years and still competes with your lovely internet shops. They have a (recently expanded) shop on Grays Inn Road, London (and a workshop/store near-by) - very expensive real-estate. They have a very loyal customer base and why? Because they provide a valuable service - physical objects you can touch and try; people you know what they're talking about and can offer advice, not pimply Saturday job types.

 

[HobbesChoice]

Getting back to the reason for this post - I've done a London to Paris cycle event this year which I helped organise so Swanny, if you want someone to sound out to then let me know.

The guys telling you to get slicks for your current bike are right. There's really no need to be spending more than you need for this trip, the slicks will do you well. It may be the difference between driving a fiat and a porsche but both can do the job and that's the important part.

 

[I am Spartacus]

no the LBS argument is much more interesting than another bike ride to Paris.. there must have been over a 100 organised this year alone..............

I have a quote for a new 105 chainset with new bottom bracket from LBS
£185 but free fitting.
They have an online presence as well .. that price in line with their online. should bring it down to a £150 ish when I cough and mention 'can you do it any better...
The parts ordered from a well known internet chain.. can be as low as £100 if not lower.
OK, here is the rub... I dont have a BB tool... I am changing a chainset into a different Shimano family... it is all no problem according to the well versed LBS person.. but do I really want the grief to do the work myself..?
We all know that when fixing bikes something ALWAYS crops up out of the blue and makes the seemingly easy into a right drama.... and a bottom bracket change isnt (for me) on the easy scale.

I am going to choose the LBS route because I know they will do a sweet job and the gear changing will be sweeter for it and the bike will also look a damn sight better.. but I do have to save up for it.

 

[blazed]

and I repeat. You clearly know nothing about economies of scale.

You really think the warehouse people pay the same per-unit price for the thousands of bikes they buy as the LBS guy that buys a couple of dozen? You don't think the manufacturers give the big suppliers sale or return deals or incentive packages?

Warehouse staff cost? They're low-skilled, out-of-town labour, i.e. cheap. Website - yes, they cost but the support cost per sale will be very small.

Try working out the operating cost per unit sold and compare an LBS and a warehouse outfit. Do you really think an LBS charges more because he can 'get away with it' and likes to mug customers?

Who needs repeat custom more? Internet-based or LBS?

You seem to think that crummy little shops really shouldn't exist and that all our shopping should either be done on the internet or at large superstores. You really don't see any benefit of local suppliers do you? Ever bought something from an LBS? I bet you have because you needed it quick or didn't want to pay 100% P&P for an inner tube or puncture repair kit.

For some research. Take a look at Condor Cycles. An LBS that's been on the go for 60 years and still competes with your lovely internet shops. They have a (recently expanded) shop on Grays Inn Road, London (and a workshop/store near-by) - very expensive real-estate. They have a very loyal customer base and why? Because they provide a valuable service - physical objects you can touch and try; people you know what they're talking about and can offer advice, not pimply Saturday job types.

I said right at the start LBS cant compete because they cant bring in enough stock to get the discounts of the big guys, you seem to think you're adding something new.

I bet the wharehouse staff earn just as much as the 17 year old kids you see working in many an LBS. Of course it is harder for the small store to make money, my point is why spend 30% more because of this. In the end they will go the way of the small corner shop, who unable to cope with the likes of Tesco Extra's popping up everywhere are closing down all over the place.

All an LBS can offer is repairs/servicing, if they all closed down it wouldn't make a difference to me in that regard since the likes of Evanscycles/Halfords are all over the place down here and are also open late. Not to mention they will fix your bike on the spot, rather than going into an LBS who are "run of their feet" because they cant cope with fixing two bikes at a time...

Who would have thought that LBS would be the new helmets argument

The people on here asking terrible questions have usually bought a bike from either a website or Halfords which might as well be a website (or a bad LBS)

For the margin an LBS might charge you're getting an experienced and knowledgeable opinion as well as support for that crucial 'why is the back tyre flat' period

It's whatever works for any given person, slagging off bike shops strikes me as incredibly ignorant, it's like slagging off small shops because supermarkets are bestest

So are the people who slag off Halfords which you just done in the same post. The reason you hear lots of Halfords horror stores is simple, they deal with thousands of people every single day. I used my local bike shop once and the "repairs" they carried out didn't fix shoot, not to mention it took them 3 days to complete this. Would have been 2 days but the ****ers are closed on a Wednesday...