London stage of Tour of Britain

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Firestorm

Veteran
Location
Southend on Sea
I caught Thursdays stage at Cley then whipped over to Holt to see them go through there. How thoughtful of the TOB organisers to go past the cottage I had rented for a weeks holiday.....

Its always going to be difficult as a spectator event, mountains or the finish excepted, basically all the regular roadside spectator will see is an insignificant couple of minutes of a 4 hour race.

that said, I don't recall the city centre criterium series of the mid 80's packing them in once the original novelty wore off and they were much better to watch.

Rayleigh in Essex used to do their own one (I think the S&C Wheelers organised it) and Southend did one of the televised events too
 

Ball

Active Member
Location
Hendon, N London
I don't understand why the Tour of Britain is in London. London is London. Nothing to do with Britain.

I can only assume you're being deliberately antagonistic
 

beastie

Guru
Location
penrith
The Tour of Britain should come to Cumbria and have a stage passing through the lakes with a mountain finish at the top of Great Dun Fell, maybe including Kirkstone Pass. Or alternatively lots more pave, classics type stage finishes. The finish at Swansea this year was a ripper.
 

theboytaylor

Well-Known Member
Location
Charlton, London
The Tour of Britain should come to Cumbria and have a stage passing through the lakes with a mountain finish at the top of Great Dun Fell, maybe including Kirkstone Pass. Or alternatively lots more pave, classics type stage finishes. The finish at Swansea this year was a ripper.

That would be great but judging by the way the routes have been funded over the last couple of years, clearly the Cumbrian RDA haven't thought it worthwhile or couldn't come up with a good enough pitch or enough cash. Perhaps with the demise of the RDAs a new source of funding will come in that enables the stages to be spread around a bit more.
 

oldroadman

Veteran
Location
Ubique
That would be great but judging by the way the routes have been funded over the last couple of years, clearly the Cumbrian RDA haven't thought it worthwhile or couldn't come up with a good enough pitch or enough cash. Perhaps with the demise of the RDAs a new source of funding will come in that enables the stages to be spread around a bit more.

"The ToB should come here, go there", a regular cry. It has days limited by the UCI to 8, and locations limited by where the cash/contracts are. Which decides the areas and to avoid massive transfers every day, has to be compacted. Then that's obvious - if you actually understand the problems of running a major stage race. The old milk race didn't have so many problems as it had 14 days to wander around, so less transfers but it NEVER finished in central London, which is where the national tour should finish.
 

theboytaylor

Well-Known Member
Location
Charlton, London
"The ToB should come here, go there", a regular cry. It has days limited by the UCI to 8, and locations limited by where the cash/contracts are. Which decides the areas and to avoid massive transfers every day, has to be compacted. Then that's obvious - if you actually understand the problems of running a major stage race. The old milk race didn't have so many problems as it had 14 days to wander around, so less transfers but it NEVER finished in central London, which is where the national tour should finish.

Why so defensive? I thought it was a great event, on a good course, with lots to be proud of. Clearly everyone's going to have their favourite places and would love to see the pros on the roads they themselves use and what's wrong with people putting those thoughts out there?

I'm sure the majority on here are simply pleased to have an event of this size in the UK. Long may it continue and hopefully it can continue to grow (either in attendance, scope or duration).

Coming on here and chipping at people who don't "understand the problems of running a major stage race" is a bit off, in my opinion. And that - just as my opinion that there should be a stage through the Forest of Ashdown - is all it is - my opinion.

If you have direct experience of running or coordinating these types of events I'm sure there are quite a few clubmen on here (or generally interested forumites) who would be interested to hear about how it's done, either to understand better the struggles you have or to organise or improve their own events, rather than simply be told we don't get it.
 

Skip Madness

New Member
What a load of ill-informed clueless comments. The last stage was scheduled for central London, long before Mr Pope decided to come. It was moved because the security extended right through the city, and so an alternative had to be found in London. Newham, being the borough for the Olympics, came up with the route (which incidentally has mostly been used for the London triathlon), including some bumpy roads in a 12 km circuit.

Did it have to go to Newham? Couldn't they have gone for a circuit in somewhere like Bushy Park or Peckham Rye? Or if you want Olympic proximity, Wanstead Flats Park? They had a prologue in Crystal Palace Park a few years ago, could that have been turned into a race circuit? Was that lifeless circuit really the best solution? (Maybe it was, I don't know.)

The Tour of Britain is usually an awful, boring race with a rubbish route. This year's race was a step in the right direction - the organisers deserve a lot of credit for the stage to Swansea which was excellently planned - but it was only a step. About halfway through I actually found myself thinking it was quite interesting, but then I realised that was only compared to the low expectations I have of the race - compared to any other stage race of its level it was standard at best. Even the more interesting stages were usually more down to the weather than a selective parcours. Fairer conditions could easily have seen six bunch sprints.

I started a topic on this issue last year in which andy_wrx made some excellent points about things to bear in mind when designing stages.

I feel that this year's inclusion of Constitution Hill undermines the argument that Porlock Hill could be too steep for team cars, so I think that would be good to go. Perhaps a stronger case against it is that the A39 is a fairly major road, but then the race used the stretch between Porlock and Lynmouth in 2007 so that doesn't seem to wash either. The race organisers still have a fetish for the West Country (very welcome chez Skip) and for that reason I came up with a stage along these lines:

6r7haw.jpg


128km from Chard to Lynton, taking in two major climbs (Exford Common and Porlock Hill) and then running down into Lynmouth before the final kilometre steeply uphill to Lynton. If necessary, Exford Common could easily be removed and/or Porlock Hill replaced with Porlock Toll Road. A stage like that would put the racers under genuine pressure in the final 40km (especially Porlock Hill), and the finish would be both sportingly and visually spectacular. On top of it all, that stretch of the A39 is quite beautiful and would have a good touristic attraction as well as a racing one, and the finish is in an area of historical and touristic note (Lynmouth flood in the 1950s, and also home of the Lynton-Lynmouth railway). There should be enough room in Lynton to mount the race vehicles.

It's so easy to criticise isn't it, when you have no idea of the work involved in running a major one-day race, let alone a UCI ranked 8 day event which must cost at least £200,000 a day, and have to negotiate all the road closure orders, book the hotels, get 350 support staff, etc., etc., etc.

We're cycling fans. When cycling fans get boring cycle races, it's normal and healthy to complain and ask for better. The Tour of Britain makes itself easy to criticise.

So can we all take a more reasoned look and be pleased that there is a national tour at all, because we didn't have one for some years after the Milk Race, Kelloggs and Prutours finished, so all power to the organisers, they deserve support and constructive ideas, and anyway my info is that the Westminster finish is already sorted out for 2011 (popes allowing!!).

There is constructiveness in complaining - it should encourage the organisers to take a fresh look at what they are doing. People should be aware of the limitations that are in place when organising a major bike race, but that shouldn't stop them calling a turd a turd, nor let them accept the polishing of such.
 

dellzeqq

pre-talced and mighty
Location
SW2
well, quite. If you're going to have a final stage, make it a good 'un. I've been to see a dozen or so final stages (including the one that went round Holborn to the delight of all of about 300 spectators) and I was one of the million that saw the TdF stage in London, and led a ride of 40 or so down to Kent for the second stage but, get this Oldroadman, there is no way on God's good earth that I'm going to schlep out to one of the least desirable parts of Newham to watch a circuit race.

Dave5N is right. Rather than run it in a crap location it would have been cleverer to take it to another city - a city that wanted it sufficiently to offer something decent. And Skip Madness is also right - it could have been put on in the City, from Old Street down to the Thames, around the Isle of Dogs, anywhere (I'm not entirely sure about Peckham, SM) with a bit of a backdrop.
 

Skip Madness

New Member
Dave5N is right. Rather than run it in a crap location it would have been cleverer to take it to another city - a city that wanted it sufficiently to offer something decent. And Skip Madness is also right - it could have been put on in the City, from Old Street down to the Thames, around the Isle of Dogs, anywhere (I'm not entirely sure about Peckham, SM) with a bit of a backdrop.

My thinking was practical - if Ratzinger's visit was to mean Central-ish areas were to be avoided then I just picked a few large-ish parks further out with the roads to form a fairly straightforward circuit. I'm not so sure in any case, though - I don't like the idea that bike races should only be about "desirable" locations. Architecture and geographical shots are always a good thing to have, but it doesn't hurt to overlook them from time to time. Top-level bike races are free to attend, something most sports can't boast, so there's already a kind of democracy or at least accessibility inherent to cycling. I don't see why that couldn't be taken further and have races taken to the doorsteps of communities which might otherwise not get a look-in. It's the presence of liveliness at the finish area which is important - somewhere where anyone passing by might stop and want to take a look. That's why this year's final stage surprised me, it seemed as though they'd actively searched for the most cold, isolated area possible.
 

dellzeqq

pre-talced and mighty
Location
SW2
"The ToB should come here, go there", a regular cry. It has days limited by the UCI to 8, and locations limited by where the cash/contracts are. Which decides the areas and to avoid massive transfers every day, has to be compacted. Then that's obvious - if you actually understand the problems of running a major stage race. The old milk race didn't have so many problems as it had 14 days to wander around, so less transfers but it NEVER finished in central London, which is where the national tour should finish.
why. Find a more rabid London chauvinist on this forum and you'd be doing well, but, for the life of me I cannot see why it 'should' end in London unless you can arrange a superb course.
 

beastie

Guru
Location
penrith
"The ToB should come here, go there", a regular cry. It has days limited by the UCI to 8, and locations limited by where the cash/contracts are. Which decides the areas and to avoid massive transfers every day, has to be compacted. Then that's obvious - if you actually understand the problems of running a major stage race. The old milk race didn't have so many problems as it had 14 days to wander around, so less transfers but it NEVER finished in central London, which is where the national tour should finish.


You have a right "can do " attitude don't ya.
 
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