Lifting and cycling.. newb here

[montage]

@ayceejay

I did a fair amount of reading on Friel's blog and decided on something like this:

2 hours in zone 1 (after lifting) on Tuesday and Friday for the next 4 weeks. 2 hours in zone 2 (after lifting) on Tuesday and Friday for the following 4 weeks. At this point it'll be May and I'll be able to go outside and do some hillwork and stuff.

I realize this isn't all that specific, but, the idea is to just do cycling training after leg days. Im hoping that a ride every 3 days will improve performance without hindering my lifting progress/recovery. I feel like I may be able to do 3 or 4 days a week in zone 1 as it may not negatively impact recovery at all.

Thoughts?

2 hours in Recovery Zone 1, by definition, will not bring about any physiological changes that will benefit your speed on the bike. 6 hours riding a week doesn't leave much room for Z1 rides.

An FTP of 175 suggests you will make lots of gains just from putting in as many hours on the bike as you can. I would stick to Z2 and Z3 rides as often as you can - if you feel like you need a rest day, take it, or do a 30-60 min Z1 ride. You seem to like structure, so try building a schedule with 10-15 min z3 blocks thrown into your Z2 rides.

Just to clarify, your threshold of 175 is power or heartrate?

 

[Rob3rt]

Not sure I agree. I lift 70lb dumbells 4-5 times a week for at least an hour. Don't seem to have many problems keeping up with the best climbers in our club;, in most situations the weightlifting seems to have given me a power to weight ratio advantage over the majority of cyclists I ride with.

. I'm about 165lbs and have always made sure that I didn't bulk up too much when I was weightlifting more seriously, in fact used to take delight in out lifting people who were often 50 or 60 pounds heavier.

Currently using the turbo 4 times a week to train for my first TT season and riding between 100-120 miles outside every week.

Struggle a bit maintaining a high pace for an extended length of time (but so do most people); not convinced this has anything to do directly with the weightlifting, more a result of not having much of an aerobic based sports background.

I hope this training is directly aimed at alleviating your problem riding at a high pace for an extended time, since that is exactly what a time trial involves!

2 hours in Recovery Zone 1, by definition, will not bring about any physiological changes that will benefit your speed on the bike. 6 hours riding a week doesn't leave much room for Z1 rides.

An FTP of 175 suggests you will make lots of gains just from putting in as many hours on the bike as you can. I would stick to Z2 and Z3 rides as often as you can - if you feel like you need a rest day, take it, or do a 30-60 min Z1 ride. You seem to like structure, so try building a schedule with 10-15 min z3 blocks thrown into your Z2 rides.

Just to clarify, your threshold of 175 is power or heartrate?

That has got to be threshold heart rate! 175W is puny!

 

[Joshua Plumtree]

I hope this training is directly aimed at alleviating your problem riding at a high pace for an extended time, since that is exactly what a time trial involves!

I'm aware of that- just thought I'd test myself at the discipline I'm probably least equipped to do. Something about training your weaknesses!

 

[ejc]

Yes 175 was my LTHR. I retested today after squats and it's actually 172. I didn't have a quality HRM the first time I tested. Is this a decent LT for an untrained (endurance) 29yo male?

I'm a bit concerned about doing a ton of z2 z3 rides, but, I know my stats and I'll know if its adversely effecting my 1RM's lifting. No harm in trying right?

I will do my harder rides after squats and deadlifts on Tuesday and Friday. Not sure how much more I should add in on other days. Typically I only train 4 days a week ( MTThF)

Thanks for the help.

ETA: During the LT test I was doing ~105RPM, Level 9, ~21.4mph, on a Precor upright indoor bike. I spent most of the time in the hoods (if u wanna call em that). Not sure if this helps give any perspective, but, I thought I'd include it. The last 5 minutes I kicked ass at level 11 and about 180BPM, 105RPM, 24mph

 

[ayceejay]

Loony toons - over and out.

 

[ejc]

What is non-specific ejc is your goal, you appear to be training for no competitive advantage at all. Obviously there is nothing wrong with this but you might enjoy your cycling much more if you do it simply for pleasure. I thought you were talking about Olympic lifting until I saw the lifts you do so would I be right in saying that you exercise to look good? Unless you want to loose weight I don't think burning calories on your bike is going to achieve much although it may add definition to your legs giving you an athletic look.

Squats, Deads, and OHP are all olympic lifts. I dont see why you think I need to compete for my training to be methodical. Do I have to be a pro skateboarder to be good and train with dedication? I TRAIN for results. I have physique goals as well as performance goals. I never mentioned burning calories to lose weight ( I control my weight via what I eat). I actually eat back all the burn from cycling [if you must know].

Ive cycled for about 5 summers and I'd just like to take a more regimented approach this year. My goal isn't non-specific. I want to be fast, period. There doesnt need to be a reason.

 

[Rob3rt]

Yes 175 was my LTHR. I retested today after squats and it's actually 172. I didn't have a quality HRM the first time I tested. Is this a decent LT for an untrained (endurance) 29yo male?

I'm a bit concerned about doing a ton of z2 z3 rides, but, I know my stats and I'll know if its adversely effecting my 1RM's lifting. No harm in trying right?

I will do my harder rides after squats and deadlifts on Tuesday and Friday. Not sure how much more I should add in on other days. Typically I only train 4 days a week ( MTThF)

Thanks for the help.

ETA: During the LT test I was doing ~105RPM, Level 9, ~21.4mph, on a Precor upright indoor bike. I spent most of the time in the hoods (if u wanna call em that). Not sure if this helps give any perspective, but, I thought I'd include it. The last 5 minutes I kicked ass at level 11 and about 180BPM, 105RPM, 24mph

Comparing LTHR, much like comparing MHR between athletes is a mugs game (LTHR will usually corresponds to around 90-93% MHR IME). What matters is how much power you produce at that heart rate!

 

[Pedrosanchezo]

Yes 175 was my LTHR. I retested today after squats and it's actually 172. I didn't have a quality HRM the first time I tested. Is this a decent LT for an untrained (endurance) 29yo male?

I'm a bit concerned about doing a ton of z2 z3 rides, but, I know my stats and I'll know if its adversely effecting my 1RM's lifting. No harm in trying right?

I will do my harder rides after squats and deadlifts on Tuesday and Friday. Not sure how much more I should add in on other days. Typically I only train 4 days a week ( MTThF)

Thanks for the help.

ETA: During the LT test I was doing ~105RPM, Level 9, ~21.4mph, on a Precor upright indoor bike. I spent most of the time in the hoods (if u wanna call em that). Not sure if this helps give any perspective, but, I thought I'd include it. The last 5 minutes I kicked ass at level 11 and about 180BPM, 105RPM, 24mph

Hey ejc,

If you plan to train in HR zones then i think it is very important you get the correct numbers from a recognised test. You mentioned Joe Friels blog so why not use his preferred method for a start.

http://www.trainingbible.com/joesblog/2009/03/heart-rate-and-training.html

Basically to find LTHR do 30 minutes at your max sustainable pace, over the duration of the full 30 mins, and take the average HR of the last 20 minutes. This will get you close enough for training zonally.

An interesting side note would be to carry out the test in the conditions you are going to be using most. So if you train mostly on turbo then do the test there, if outdoors then do the test there. Point being that some find their HR higher or lower on a turbo if they are used to riding outdoors and vice versa. I can never hit the same HR's on the turbo, personally speaking. I train mostly outdoors so it would make sense for me to test outdoors.

Once you get that sorted then you will have a complete set of zones to work in, fully in the knowledge that the numbers are correct for you.

 

[ayceejay]

My apologies ejc. I found your post vague and was attempting to draw more information from you not to insult you so I am sorry if that is what came across.

 

[ejc]

Hey ejc,

If you plan to train in HR zones then i think it is very important you get the correct numbers from a recognised test. You mentioned Joe Friels blog so why not use his preferred method for a start.

http://www.trainingbible.com/joesblog/2009/03/heart-rate-and-training.html

Basically to find LTHR do 30 minutes at your max sustainable pace, over the duration of the full 30 mins, and take the average HR of the last 20 minutes. This will get you close enough for training zonally.

An interesting side note would be to carry out the test in the conditions you are going to be using most. So if you train mostly on turbo then do the test there, if outdoors then do the test there. Point being that some find their HR higher or lower on a turbo if they are used to riding outdoors and vice versa. I can never hit the same HR's on the turbo, personally speaking. I train mostly outdoors so it would make sense for me to test outdoors.

Once you get that sorted then you will have a complete set of zones to work in, fully in the knowledge that the numbers are correct for you.

That's the test I did. I'll retest outdoors when this snow is gone.