Judge wants us banned from dual carriageways!

[oldfatfool]

The speeds quoted by the judge are not are not only seen on dual carriageways and motorways, the national speed limit for single carriageways is 60mph, roads without the luxury of an additional overtaking lane. If the roads cyclists are allowed to use is to be determined by the speed of the motorised traffic then it would indeed be the thin end of the wedge.

My thoughts exactly, many rural, quiet, pleasurable cycling roads have a 60 limit, will we be banned from these as well?

 

[Mugshot]

however dual carriageways do tend to have a much larger volume of fast moving traffic including loads of HGV's. Maybe the quote in the OP was thinking more along the lines of bypasses which are specifically constructed for motor vehicles.

That is a reasonable assumption on behalf of the quote in the OP, and you're right with regards to volume. I'm quite sure nothing will come of it but it's an interesting debate.
If we look at the volume of traffic, which could be what the judge is referring to, at what point do we decide that busy is too busy? For example at rush hour on a single carriageway where a national speed limit applies do we have an upper limit of how many cars per a set period of time are using it before we ban cyclists, or do we take an average speed for them and as it is likely to be lower than national speed limit due to the volume of traffic allow the cyclists to use it despite the volume of traffic, providing it's below a certain mph?

 

[MontyVeda]

My thoughts exactly, many rural, quiet, pleasurable cycling roads have a 60 limit, will we be banned from these as well?

FFS please don't try to read between the lines because you're clearly not very good at it.

 

[oldfatfool]

FFS please don't try to read between the lines because you're clearly not very good at it.

Eh? Some judge wants cyclists banned from duel carriageways because traffic moves at 60 mph, If that is implemented how long before some other eeejit comes along and says that cyclists should be excluded from all national speed limit roads?

How many drivers would agree with that sentiment? As a cyclist I probably feel safer on some duel carriageways than on some roads in rural areas,Snake Pass etc etc that attract lunatic bikers and hooning car drivers, and speaking as a driver I would sooner not have to worry about cyclists on narrow winding country lanes myself.

 

[Trickedem]

I don't have much enthusiasm for riding on A roads and tend to avoid where possible. However there is no way I want to be banned from using them. I have cycled on the A2, which is more of a motorway than many motorways and I have cycled on quite a few other similar roads whilst riding Audaxes. But I have done it at 4am in the morning and figured that the advantages outweighed the risk.

 

[Ian Cooper]

...Vehicles closing on a cyclist(s) doing <20 mph when they are doing ~70 mph is never going to be a good combination. I will not ride on such roads anymore after this little incident so have already have a self imposed de facto ban...

If you cycle that far left, it's no wonder motorists think they can squeeze past you in the same lane. If you ride like that, I agree that you should not be riding on roads that have a high speed limit. But to argue that the judge has a fair point and that cyclists should be banned, based on your (frankly) suicidal cycling behaviour, is nonsense.

The following are from the US, but the same principles apply (just on the opposite side of the road):


View: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6W0twza9B7o&feature=plcp


View: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0B18Pwdnybo&feature=plcp

http://commuteorlando.com/wordpress/animations/lane-control/

Please, for your own sake, learn to ride safely - in the lane so that drivers can easily see you and know change lanes in plenty of time.

 

[gavintc]

Eh? Some judge wants cyclists banned from duel carriageways because traffic moves at 60 mph, If that is implemented how long before some other eeejit comes along and says that cyclists should be excluded from all national speed limit roads?

How many drivers would agree with that sentiment? As a cyclist I probably feel safer on some duel carriageways than on some roads in rural areas,Snake Pass etc etc that attract lunatic bikers and hooning car drivers, and speaking as a driver I would sooner not have to worry about cyclists on narrow winding country lanes myself.

+1. A ban from dual carriageways is not the answer. Like others, I find many urban dual carriageways some of the best and safest roads to be on.

 

[middleagecyclist]

If you cycle that far left, it's no wonder motorists think they can squeeze past you in the same lane....Please, for your own sake, learn to ride safely - in the lane so that drivers can easily see you and know change lanes in plenty of time.

Ian.

You fail to see the whole context of the video. I was on a heavy touring bike and going up hill into a head wind. The cycle lane had just run out and I was cycling down the widish shoulder. This was just disappearing in the video.

So, how are slower cyclists supposed to use these types of roads? I can just imagine some old dear on a shopper taking primary in lane one of the 70+ mph A19 dual carriageway.

 

[MrJamie]

I see quite a few cyclists on the dual carriageway grid roads of Milton Keynes and I can never decide if its ballsy or just insane. Plenty of people drive 70-80mph and in the evenings you do see people going faster and racing eachother, I knew a guy who would try to hit a ton between every roundabout.

 

[martint235]

Ian.

You fail to see the whole context of the video. I was on a heavy touring bike and going up hill into a head wind. The cycle lane had just run out and I was cycling down the widish shoulder. This was just disappearing in the video.

So, how are slower cyclists supposed to use these types of roads? I can just imagine some old dear on a shopper taking primary in lane one of the 70+ mph A19 dual carriageway.

If you're going to cycle a road like that then you have to cycle it in such a manner that a car can't overtake you while they have another vehicle on their right hand side. I don't think you need to be very far out but you do need to force the overtake into the next lane.

 

[StuAff]

I rode the A27 and A35 in both directions today (to Bournemouth and back), including stretches of dual carriageway. Nothing too scary, IMHO. If I had felt in danger/intimidated by traffic levels and speed, I'd have got off sharpish.

 

[Andy84]

"At such a closing speed a relatively small and very vulnerable “object” is coming into view at the rate of 60ft per second and in a moment’s inattention irreparable damage is done."

I would have thought that the more obvious 'immediate remedy' would be to reduce the speed limit, therefore these 'objects' (yes mr judge doesn't think of you as a person, but as an object) would come in to view at a slower rate.

Or, why not just 'remove all motor vehicles'?

 

[middleagecyclist]

If you're going to cycle a road like that then you have to cycle it in such a manner that a car can't overtake you while they have another vehicle on their right hand side. I don't think you need to be very far out but you do need to force the overtake into the next lane.

Thanks for the advice. It might just be me but if I am struggling to get over 10mph on these kind of roads with that much traffic there is no way I have the confidence/balls to take a strong secondary or primary position. In such circumstances now I give them a wide berth.

 

[middleagecyclist]

I would have thought that the more obvious 'immediate remedy' would be to reduce the speed limit, therefore these 'objects' (yes mr judge doesn't think of you as a person, but as an object) would come in to view at a slower rate.

So the solution on fast dual carriageway major trunk routes such as the A1 or A19 (ones I know well) is to reduce the speed limit so cyclists can be accomodated with more safety? What speed should it be reduced to from the 70 mph speed allowed I wonder?

Or, why not just 'remove all motor vehicles'?

So turning them into defacto ...mega cycle lanes!

You get my vote but I doubt you'll get a majority with those policies.

 

[martint235]

Thanks for the advice. It might just be me but if I am struggling to get over 10mph on these kind of roads with that much traffic there is no way I have the confidence/balls to take a strong secondary or primary position. In such circumstances now I give them a wide berth.

Probably a good call. I don't think anyone should cycle on a road they aren't comfortable on. It's a shame that we have these kinds of roads but the reality is they exist and we need to deal with them. Calls to ban cars just aren't going to help