Is this the driver of the car's fault?

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Location
España
I think this is the key
The cyclist could have been more careful and the driver can still be at fault. Both those things can be true.

From my own experience, a lot of my reactions depend very much on the way I'm feeling. Some descents are done with joy, exuberance and at top speed, others can be fearful, defensive and slow. On a different day with a different feeling the same road might be handled differently.
Certainly, my opinions on what a cyclist should or shouldn't have done are very different sitting in front of a screen than they would be if I was on a saddle.

I know it's the Internet but the way this discussion has gone down the tubes is quite distasteful and, it has to be said, sad, on a cycling forum. All black or white, little nuance or subtlety.
A simple example: I'd imagine that someone out on a training ride or looking for a PB or to top a segment might have a very different attitude to the exact situation outlined in the terrifying video than someone out for a pootle.

If cyclists don't even look for common ground with other cyclists how can anyone expect the situation on UK roads to ever improve?

The introduction of hypotheticals and then the use of said hypotheticals to batter a poster is veering pretty close to bullying in my book.

This place is losing its friendly vibe. Rapidly.

On a bike I am a vulnerable road user. Laws are in place to protect me, to assign responsibility. Laws won't repair my injuries or bring me back to life in the event of an incident. The best way I can continue to ride my bike is to do so as safely as possible. I try not to judge others but someone else's misfortune is an opportunity for me to re-examine how I do things. If some call that victim blaming, so be it. I call it common sense.
 

Jody

Stubborn git
The introduction of hypotheticals and then the use of said hypotheticals to batter a poster is veering pretty close to bullying in my book.

This place is losing its friendly vibe. Rapidly.

If that was my post's, then please accept my apologies @winjim

That wasn't my intention and why I backed out of further posts.
 

winjim

Smash the cistern
If that was my post's, then please accept my apologies @winjim

That wasn't my intention and why I backed out of further posts.

To be fair I was replying with short posts while busy doing other stuff so I may have machine gunned the thread a bit. I think you and I got our wires crossed and when we realised that we both stood back.

@icowden managed to summarise my position pretty well so I must have been making some sense. I'm slightly baffled by the suggestion that I was the instigator of that particular branch of the discussion but there you go. Anyway it must be someone else's turn to have an argument today.
 

Svendo

Guru
Location
Walsden
Good morning,

Quite a few years back I was as surprised to read that a juror got a custodial sentence because on his own time he visitied the scene of a RTA that he was on the jury considering.

The legal system is slow and it was pointed out to the juror that what he saw on that day was completely different to the conditions when the accident occured so he was drawing completely invalid conclusions.

I am quite a high mileage rider and the driver was clearly in the wrong but on the story as presented I really can't see why that accident deserved a prision sentence.

I managed to drive 50k miles a year plus a 50 hour working week for a decade without hitting anyone. Then one day I pulled out in front of a cyclist after I had come to a complete stop at a roundabout on a 6 mile roundtrip to the supermarket, the saving grace was that he was going so slowly that I could claim that I saw him and knew that I had time to pull out and it is not even obvious to me that he thought I had pulled out in front of him.

He was wearing a lime green high vis jacket and I have always been curious as to why I didn't see him and as far as I can tell it was simply that he was percevied as a stationary object, he was moving so slowly that nothing was changing in my field of vision and the lime green jacket was very low contrast against the background which was hedges and trees.

Bye

Ian

The other possible mechanism, which may or may not apply in this case as you’d come to a stop, is the a-pillar blocking a cyclist (or motorcyclist), which with the movement of the cyclist and the bend into the roundabout of the approach, creates a moving blind spot our brains aren’t so good at accounting for. My practice is to lean forward to check round the a-pillar when approaching junctions, especially roundabouts.
Years ago I saw a video from the drivers perspective showing a motorcycle completely concealed by the a pillar as the car approached ta roundabout. Even knowing about it I was quite surprised by how completely it was blocked. Unfortunately I can’t find it or similar with a quick google.
 

winjim

Smash the cistern
The other possible mechanism, which may or may not apply in this case as you’d come to a stop, is the a-pillar blocking a cyclist (or motorcyclist), which with the movement of the cyclist and the bend into the roundabout of the approach, creates a moving blind spot our brains aren’t so good at accounting for. My practice is to lean forward to check round the a-pillar when approaching junctions, especially roundabouts.
Years ago I saw a video from the drivers perspective showing a motorcycle completely concealed by the a pillar as the car approached ta roundabout. Even knowing about it I was quite surprised by how completely it was blocked. Unfortunately I can’t find it or similar with a quick google.

Tom Scott covers it with this junction.


View: https://youtu.be/SYeeTvitvFU?si=2ZyImu9HmzFzRERP


Which has since been fixed.


View: https://youtu.be/OpgpE6wjF30?si=xCbd1YRyU-OCF4Pz
 
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