I'm getting worse! Newbie time in saddle and hill advice

[Nigelnaturist]

@Reddragon it was true, here I have an from one point two routes to climb home one way its shorter but steeper the other way though it still has a climb about 10% briefly is more gradual, the shorter whilst steeper on the whole peaks about 8% the short way about 3/4 mile the other just over a mile, total climb about 100ft, but thats about as much climbing as there is on most of my current rides, there are a few short brutal climbs but only about 1/2 a mile and about 120ft.

 

[boydj]

Getting the saddle height is important and it's also important not to be pushing too high a gear. Too high a gear will burn your thighs. Lower gear and faster legs is more efficient - up to a point. No grinding, except where it can't be helped on steep hills.

 

[Reddragon]

I think I will concentrate on going uphill from the house and then coming home is mainly downhill except for a couple of steep (up to 14%) but short hills, I think going downhill from home buggers me for getting home!

 

[Berk on a Bike]

@Reddragon This is a 3D profile of the steepest bit taken from your Strava entry. My thighs burn just looking at it. As previous posters have said, grinding up gradients might be doing the damage. As your confidence grows, getting out of the saddle for short stints might help too.

 

[Reddragon]

Ouch @Berk on a Bike, not suprised that hurt when it looks like that! I think I will give that one a miss for a couple of weeks then try it again

 

[earlestownflya]

sit on your bike..put your HEEL on the pedal take the pedal to the bottom of the stroke..your leg should more or less straight if your seat is at the right height..that's my method anyway

 

[RichardB]

sit on your bike..put your HEEL on the pedal take the pedal to the bottom of the stroke..your leg should more or less straight if your seat is at the right height..that's my method anyway

Absolutely correct. What works for me is to get the pedal crank in line with the seat tube and put my heel on the pedal, then adjust the saddle so that the leg is totally straight with the knee locked. When you ride with the ball of your foot on the pedal, this gives you a nice slight bend at the knee when fully extended. If that's nowhere near where you are at the moment, move the saddle half an inch at a time and give yourself time to get used to it. It looks ridiculously high if you're not used to it, and my wife still says it loos 'dangerous', but the increase in power when you get it right is amazing. Don't worry about touching the floor. If the saddle is the right height, you won't be able to touch the floor (except perhaps with the tip of one toe). As long as you can come off the saddle and straddle the bike before you stop, you'll be fine.

As for gearing, if your route is hilly, you need some nice low gears. Even though you have 27, they may not have the range you need. Count the teeth on your largest sprocket (at the back) and the smallest chainwheel at the front. If they are the same size, or the chainwheel has fewer teeth than the large sprocket, then you have low gears. If not, it might be worth asking your local bike shop if you can change the sprocket cluster for one with a bigger low gear. The idea of gearing is to match the very limited output of the human leg (compared to a car, I mean) with the varying terrain, so you spin at roughly the same speed and make roughly the same effort whatever the terrain - you just go slower on hills compared to the flat.

And think yourself lucky! Hills are what gets you fit. Imagine living in the fens, and having to travel miles just to find a hill. Like you, if I go anywhere from my house it involves a hill. I try to think of it as a blessing.

 

[Reddragon]

Thanks @RichardB very helpful

 

[Nigelnaturist]

@RichardB done it already
The set up I belive is this
48/38/28 with a 11-12-14-16-18-21-24-28-32 cassette
@Reddragon the numbers across the top are the number of teeth in chain rings, inner to outer, those down the left the rear cassette, the coloured numbers are the gear inches (which is the ratio of the (front teeth/rear teeth)x the diameter of the wheel in inches) example 28/14=1:2 ratio multiply 26.3 nominal road wheel = 52.6"
The lower the gear inch the easier it is to pedal. The red are gears you should avoid it could be said the extremes 1 and 9 on the middle ring too, but I don't worry to much about that one, my bike isn't too keen on the middle and low gear.
As almost anyone on here will tell you, this set up has a really low end, and a good range, and the changes in ratios are not too bad.

28 would be the no 1 gear on the left, 38 2 ect, and like wise on the back but in reverse 32 being 1 to 11 being 9.
Hope this helps.

 

[Yazzoo]

@Nigelnaturist thats brilliant - I am slightly baffled by gears, I've posted on here before about it, but that makes it so much clearer, thank you!

 

[Nigelnaturist]

@Nigelnaturist thats brilliant - I am slightly baffled by gears, I've posted on here before about it, but that makes it so much clearer, thank you!

Y.W.
Many people say there is more redundancy on triples, my argument is they are used in different situations, and you general have more options, the above example you could take the gearing lower, depending on the chainset (not looked it up) but if it has interchangeable rings you could take the 28th inner down to 26th and change the RD to take a 34 or 36th ( I think I saw one) to give a 19" gear.

 

[Nigelnaturist]

This is my 10sp setup in comparison

You can see that my low gear on the 28x23 (32") is actually higher than the low gear on the 38x32 (31.2") though the wheel diameter will have an effect. The % figures show the % change between gears.
When I started in 2012, I was using low gears like a 26x28=24" that was 3 years ago, so just keep at it.

 

[Yazzoo]

That makes much more sense. This was my earlier thread:

https://www.cyclechat.net/threads/compact-vs-double-explain-please.186466/

It digressed into a bit of petty sniping and willy waving in the middle but amongst it there was some good bits of advice!

 

[Nigelnaturist]

@Yazzoo I don't like what is referred to as a compact (50/34) a compact is defined by its B.C.D. that being normally 110mm a normal double 130mm (there are variations on these measurements), its the same with triples I ride a compact triple 74mm inner ring with the middle and the outer being 110mm, my other triple crankset is 130mm outer but a really odd inner (its a prowheel) and I couldn't find rings in its size.
Many people go for compacts on the advise of others, then are looking for low gearing
Take this example this is a 50/34 on an 11sp 12-25

My average gear inch is about the 61" mark which on a compact puts me towards the extremes of each front ring.
now take my triple set up

That 61" is now pretty central on the middle ring, much less lateral wear on the chain, its possibly why I get over 3,000 miles a chain.
To get a compact as low as mine you have to fit a 28th rear, on an 11sp its not so bad as you would lose the 18th, but I find that 17-19 jump quite a large one, however on any thing less you start losing things like the 16th and most cassettes with a large rear cog usually start at 11th, which on a 50x11 is 120" only ever used down hill, so to my mind a waste, unless your extremely fit.

I can change my setup to a 26/38/50 and a 12-27 to give

Almost as low as the 28x32 setup on the O.P. setup, however I don't much like the drop from the 38 to 26 as I have to go quite a way back down the cassette (or up) to be in the same range, a bit like a 50/34 compact setup.
This is another option, giving a greater range with a slightly lower gear than my current set up, and pretty much the same central 60" gearing.

The options are almost endless, but we are being forced into certain choices by the choice of a 50/34 over a triple.
Any setup on a 110mm bcd crankset is a compact by the way even a 52/39 variations 52/36 50/38 48/36 ect.... a normal double of 130mm can not take a chain ring of less than 38th due to the dimensions, and a 110mm bcd can not take less than 34th (though I did read of a 33th).

Sorry to have digressed from the main post, but hope this helps.

 

[Yazzoo]

It really does thanks, sorry to the OP for crashing your post - I do feel more enlightened now!