Ideas to making cycling safer in London and towns and cities up and down the land....

[MrHappyCyclist]

Probably the most important idea in the first instance would be for cyclists all to speak up at once, and all to speak with the same message. If every single person on CycleChat alone were to write to their MP about, for example, presumed liability, that might get noticed. (Or maybe not.)

Why do I mention presumed liability? Well, there is not a consensus about segregation so there's little point in trying to get people to put a common message across on that, and in any case, there will be no significant segregated infrastructure created in the short term given the financial constraints. So, we have to share with motor vehicles no matter what our ideal position would be. The biggest problem with sharing is the culture and attitude of motorists who, at the very least, fail to leave sufficient margin for error when driving. The only two ways to address that are: education, and legislation to make drivers bear more of the consequences of their actions. The biggest obstacle getting in the way of the latter is a lack of political will in the face of a strong motoring lobby.

 

[Gbola]

While I agree with your sentiments separating cyclists from motor vehicles it is the thin end of a very thick wedge to my thinking and will only lead to the general belief among motorists that cyclists have no right to be on the road anywhere. I have said this on another thread, the only way forward is to change the law as per most other countries in Europe and give way to cyclists. None of this nonsense of having to stop if you are on a cycle path for every road, drive or track you cross. We need to make the penalties high for any vehicle that hits a cyclist, full stop.

I support your argument. Being a cyclist and someone who does about 3000 miles of driving per month

 

[Gbola]

When I say segregation I mean totally separate. Not cycle lanes - cycle roads that aren't shared. It wont happen of course but deaths will continue as long as cycles and cars are on the road as sure as eggs are eggs and no amount of training/laws/sentences/education will change that. Most tattooed, cross-eyed, boneheads who learn to drive at 17 drive at the speed limit. As soon as they pass their test they drive their Subaru Impreza's at ridiculous speeds. Factor in people who aren't very good at judging distances (most women), people with poor eyesight, complacent drivers (Lorries, taxi drivers, WVM), foreigners who passed their tests in Nairobi and Delhi and people who simply make the occasional mistake it's a mystery things aren't worse than they already are.

And really what percentage of accidents in this country are caused by foreign born car owners? Do they disproportionately cause more accidents than the ''natives'' ? I hope you know you can only drive with a foreign driving licence within the first year of your arrival in UK? Please provide your evidence

 

[Gbola]

Cyclists themselves need some training. I have since noticed the difference in the attitude of the motorists to me (whether forced or not) since I started following the advice of John Franklin in his book ''cyclecraft''.

 

[brokenflipflop]

And really what percentage of accidents in this country are caused by foreign born car owners? Do they disproportionately cause more accidents than the ''natives'' ? I hope you know you can only drive with a foreign driving licence within the first year of your arrival in UK? Please provide your evidence

Your kidding right? Anyone with a driving license from anywhere can drive on our roads for a whole year. Bloody Hell ! That doesn't apply to pilots and gun ownership and such like does it ?

 

[brokenflipflop]

My friend, the second quote suggests you are utterly beyond enlightenment!

Yeah, but now we're friends you'll forgive me right ?

 

[Zoiders]

Ahhh Gbola...the little sock puppet.

 

[Gbola]

Your kidding right? Anyone with a driving license from anywhere can drive on our roads for a whole year. Bloody Hell ! That doesn't apply to pilots and gun ownership and such like does it ?

Don't forget you can drive in foreign countries with your licence as well.

 

[brokenflipflop]

Probably the most important idea in the first instance would be for cyclists all to speak up at once, and all to speak with the same message. If every single person on CycleChat alone were to write to their MP about, for example, presumed liability, that might get noticed. (Or maybe not.)

Why do I mention presumed liability? Well, there is not a consensus about segregation so there's little point in trying to get people to put a common message across on that, and in any case, there will be no significant segregated infrastructure created in the short term given the financial constraints. So, we have to share with motor vehicles no matter what our ideal position would be. The biggest problem with sharing is the culture and attitude of motorists who, at the very least, fail to leave sufficient margin for error when driving. The only two ways to address that are: education, and legislation to make drivers bear more of the consequences of their actions. The biggest obstacle getting in the way of the latter is a lack of political will in the face of a strong motoring lobby.

The evidence/public information films/common knowledge and the law suggest that people know full well the consequences of using a mobile phone whilst driving - the worst outcome is obviously killing someone, perhaps get a fine and 3 points, perhaps get away with it. So why do people still do it? Apply the same logic to drivers apathy towards cyclists and other road users - it wont ever change no matter what the consequences are. Getting from A to B in an X5 to pick up Tarquin and Tabitha is the priority and then to get back home around the corner ASAP to make tea (dinner) for Tobias before Tarquin has Lacrosse training.

 

[Gbola]

I think how to react to cyclists must be incorporated into driving lessons compulsorily. This should also be tested compulsorily in the theory and practical aspects of the driving test.

 

[brokenflipflop]

I fear your sweeping and inaccurate generalisations may have killed what could have been quite an interesting thread.

But that's half the fun of an online forum.

Almost always without exception I am in the minority of one where my opinion is concerned. My children call me a freak but I like to think I'm unconventional.

 

[Zoiders]

Do they teach how to react to cyclists when you train as a vet in Switzerland?

 

[Gbola]

What about raising public awareness, making it a public issue. Can cyclist organisations force government fund advertisement on how motorists should interact with cyclists? Can this be funded by the organisations themselves?

 

[Little yellow Brompton]

Your kidding right? Anyone with a driving license from anywhere can drive on our roads for a whole year. Bloody Hell ! That doesn't apply to pilots and gun ownership and such like does it ?

Yes it does apply to pilots and gun owners, they can also legally drive on out roads for a year with a driving liceence from anywhere.

 

[brokenflipflop]

Advertisement of starving kid - yeah, that'll work, sure. Advert with Johnny Iceberg on his top of the range CF, lycra'd up in Assos - don't think it'll get the sympathy vote really.