How to pace myself for longer rides?

[rich p]

The more you ride, the fitter you get and more experience to know what pace to ride, how much to eat or drink, whether to cane it up the hills just for fun, have a race with the bloke ahead or that bus. Just do it and learn as you go and don't get hung up on pseudo scientific mumbo jumbo.
Just enjoy it!

 

[Bill Gates]

If I Remember Correctly, the Original Poster asked "How to pace myself for longer rides?".

From reading his Original Post, I deduced he was asking for help as regards the speed to ride in order to complete the trip without knackering himself half way by setting of too fast.

My chart "Albatross & Minogue" shows Academic research by the National Aeronautical and Space Administration when they evaluated the physical durability of potential astronauts. ( Even NASA consider a bicycle a valuable tool for gauging fitness ).

The website "ANAL ytical cycling" gives the Original Poster an idea of his power vs speed.

Using the two charts, the Original Poster can cross reference an expected sustained power output for the timescale he is envisaging, and then cross reference the speed at which that power dictates.

A couple or three iterations of the process will give him a reasonable idea of what speed to ride his entire ride to avoid 'speeding off like a lunatic' and getting muscle fatigue, failure and cramps miles before the finish.

This is 'Technical – Health, fitness & training', is it not? I had been told in the first quarter of this year to keep this 'Technical' stuff off 'Beginners'.

Now, it appears there are some on this forum who don't want 'Technical' issues in the 'Technical' department.

I did mention Mr Christopher Boardman who gained the hour record ( on a bike built by Lotus, designed by Mr Mike Burrows, also of Windcheetah Speedy fame ). Chris did a lot of wind tunnel testing at MIRA in the nineties to evaluate aerodynamics and his RLC. He used this data to 'pace himself' for the record attempt ride.

Now that's pretty serious when a World record is at stake.

If the Original Poster does not feel his own ride is 'serious'??? ( Why would he ask if he didn't? ) he can ignore my help and devise his own strategy.

What none on this chatboard really need is all the sarcasm and 'arguing the toss' over something that is internationally recognized as 'sound data' ie David Gordon Wilson, Jim Papadopoulos and Frank Rowland Whitt's book "Bicycling Science". MIT.

Bill, you're attempting to turn this thread into one which addresses 'Training'. It isn't. The Original Poster uses the term 'Training' as a general expression of going out on a ride to get fitter. He admits he's not competing in anything. It's a person's question about sensible riding speeds to complete a 65 mile ride.
He was unsure, so he asked.

I do hope the Original Poster uses what has been offered to his advantage.

Blah Blah Blah!!

Please correct me if I'm wrong but does not the constructed RLC and chart assume that you are going for the alloted time at the fastest one is capable of going. i.e.Sustainable power.

So unless you're going flat out all the time then what the hell is it good for?

I was questioning your assertion that any "respectable" cyclist should have this knowledge; not that the science is somehow invalid. Anyway this is getting really boring now and I can't be ar**d anymore.

 

[jimboalee]

Yawn..zzzzzzzzzzzzz


Oh Bill and Rich,

It's up to XmisterIX to decide whether my contributions are worthwhile, not you.

All the info is on the internet, sorry, all the pseudo scientific mumbo jumbo is on the internet.

 

[Ian H]

One important piece of advice for training - doesn't require graphs or power monitors - is to vary your pace. Have an easy but longer ride one or two days, followed by a shorter, more intense effort the next. The intense efforts improve your aerobic threshold and thus the pace you can sustain over longer distances increases. It doesn't need to be any more scientific than that unless you're racing.

 

[Bill Gates]

Yawn..zzzzzzzzzzzzz


Oh Bill and Rich,

It's up to XmisterIX to decide whether my contributions are worthwhile, not you.

All the info is on the internet, sorry, all the pseudo scientific mumbo jumbo is on the internet.

I've just seen the light. What I will do is to measure my cda rolling downhill as you describe but I'm going to need to do a number of measurements.

1) in the tuck - wearing winter garb

2) on the hoods - wearing winter garb

3) in the tuck - weraring summer garb

4) on the hoods - wearing summer garb

5) 6) 7) 8) half on hoods half in the tuck

Then I need to go flat out for 20 minutes/30 minutes/40 minutes etc. and build myself a nice little graph for each cda variable and have available on me these graphs for say all times with a 10 minutes variation up to 4 hours, then the next time I'm going flat out and I'm not sure if I can last the distance I can whip out the relevant graph from the large binder strapped to my back and.... Oh I just realised the trouble is I don't use power measurements....oh well back to the drawing board.

 

[jimboalee]

I will revise my suggestions for you OP.

Go on the 100km ride, riding as slow as you can.
If you get it finished, try riding a bit faster next week.

Repeat this until you can finish the 100 km ride without being sick in the garden hedge.

Then you will know how fast you should be riding,,, Simples.

 

[rich p]

I will revise my suggestions for you OP.

Go on the 100km ride, riding as slow as you can.
If you get it finished, try riding a bit faster next week.

Repeat this until you can finish the 100 km ride without being sick in the garden hedge.

Then you will know how fast you should be riding,,, Simples.

Eureka! At last you're catching up

 

[jimboalee]

Another suggestion for you OP.

Join Audax UK.

While you are riding 100 km rides finding out what speed to ride, after ten rides, you can claim a Brevet 1000 badge.

 

[XmisterIS]

If it's Ergomo, Powertap or SRM you're thinking of, this is the first time I've heared their pricetag described as "a few quid"....

How much cash you got in 'aamshur'?

Lol!

I am thinking ASDA Smartprice ... the cheapest one in the shop! Minimal functionality, does what it says on the tin, gives me a rough idea of power.

EDIT: Happy times - http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/Models.aspx?ModelID=39122

 

[Noodley]

Lol!

I am thinking ASDA Smartprice ... the cheapest one in the shop! Minimal functionality, does what it says on the tin, gives me a rough idea of power.

EDIT: Happy times - http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/Models.aspx?ModelID=39122

That is for heart rate not power. Power thingies costs loads.

My advice - go for a ride, a lot.

 

[jimboalee]

Any device that calculates 'Calories used' using the heartrate as the incoming variable, employs a 'cook-book' equation.
There is no direct co-relation.

Watts can be calculated from kCals per minute.

kCals per minute is Total Cals divided by minutes duration.

The answer will be very 'Wild and Wooly' indeed. So 'Wild and Wooly', I wouldn't trust it.

The 'Mumbo jumbo' on this occasion is 1 KiloWatt = 14.32 kCal per minute.

 

[Banjo]

When I was much younger (18) and used to ride my bike everywhere, I once did 100 miles off-road, in one day.

Then I had a long break from cycling and only got back into it 3 years ago (aged 30).

My "training" ride is 25 miles long and when I am on good form, I can do it in just over an hour. I say "training" in quotes, because I'm not training for anything in particular, I just like riding because it keeps me fit and keeps the weight off! (I do a sedentary job).

Anyway, 25 miles in just over an hour equates to approx 20 mph average.

I would like to start lengthening my rides, but I find it hard to set the right pace!

I am going to get a cycle computer that can keep track of my average speed.

What average speed do you try to maintain per length of ride?

For example, I might aim for something like this:

25 miles = 20 mph average.
40 miles = 15 mph average.
65 miles = 10 mph average.

Is that reasonable?

It think it's important to know because I would hate to set out on a 65 mile ride, get half way round (i.e. 30+ miles from home), and suddenly realise that I'm not going to make it because I've set my pace too high!

Im no expert but have been surprised to notice that my average speed over longer distances are not much slower than over shorter distances.

eg on a regular 25 mile route I do i usually average about 13.5 on a 100 miler I recently averaged 12.8

A lot depends on how you feel on the day and obviously on the amount of climbing.

If you can average 20 mph over 25 miles then I think you will do a lot better than 10 over 65 miles.

 

[lukesdad]

the above post is quite correct as long as you get some recovery in the ride sufficient food and liquid performance (in this case av. speed) should onlydrop marginally.

My pb. for a 25 is just under 57 mins yet my pb for a 100 is 4 hrs 12 mins as you can see theres not a great drop in average speed,training to do it takes in alot of variables far too many to go into here but I would say that average speed is an incidental of training not a benchmark.

 

[plank]

I think you will drop 1mph average per 50 miles you ride from your 20 mile average untill you run of gas! Longer rides are much more important to keep eating and drinking on.

 

[jimboalee]

The chart I posted ( Gross, Kyle ) shows that research on this subject has been done. The NASA curves are from 1964, and surprisingly, men haven't improved much physiologically since then.

The OP has some data of his own. He rode for 77 minutes and his 20 mph equates to approx 200 Watts, so he's just better than the UK Amateur tourist trials of Whitt's research.

It is a simple matter for the OP to copy and paste the chart onto a MS Word document, print it out and plot with a red pen HIS curve from 77mins/200Watts IN RATIO to the 'UK Amateur tourist trials' dotted line.

So for a 100 km ride, at 4 hours riding duration, the Wattage will be 110, or 15.75 mph. 4 x 15.75 = 63 or just over 100km.

That's close enough by reading off a printed chart.

The result is :- Start and sustain your speed to average 15.75 mph, not 20 mph.