Health & Safety gone ... just gone

[Globalti]

Have you seen the Safety Data Sheet for Dihydrogen Monoxide? It's a hidden killer yet people are allowed to handle it in their own homes with no training.

 

[classic33]

Have you seen the Safety Data Sheet for Dihydrogen Monoxide? It's a hidden killer yet people are allowed to handle it in their own homes with no training.

Some advice here, http://dhmo.org

 

[presta]

When I was at Newcastle YHA it was obvious that they'd had a recent visit from H&S, the members kitchen was festooned with withering droll notices like the one over the kettle: "Parents are asked not to pour boiling water over their children, as it damages them".

 

[palinurus]

Have you seen the Safety Data Sheet for Dihydrogen Monoxide? It's a hidden killer yet people are allowed to handle it in their own homes with no training.

I've seen many, I used to buy high-purity water for the lab (we haven't used it for a long time as we no longer have any analytical function). I learned a lot about reading SDSs from those- mainly that a lot of the content was boilerplate, but there was important stuff in there. For example: I use a lot of different solvents- usually uncommon ones- and I almost always need to heat them, so flashpoint and autoignition temperatures are pretty important.

OK, the SDSs for water are fairly sensible- not considered hazardous- but there were all sorts of oddities in there like:

• Advice for firefighters: no data available
• 'prevent product from entering drains'
• in case of skin contact: Wash off with soap and plenty of water
• In case of eye contact: flush eyes with water as a precaution

Every single SDS seems to contain phrase regarding gloves and eye protection whether it's water, steel... pretty much anything (I've seen one for steel capillary tubes which recommends washing hands with soap and water after handling)

 

[Globalti]

I wonder if there's an SDS for novachok?

 

[Arrowfoot]

There is always "this type" somewhere. In this case a pharmacy chain hired a in-house investigator to handle pilferage in their stores. Guy goes out in the first week to a store decides that a staff has pocketed a promotional gift meant for a customer. He further identifies other staff that have pocketed these promotional gifts. He lodges a Police report and the Police arrest these staff. As a result the store had to be closed.

Investigation and that includes store CCTV viewing shows that customers have actually turned down these gifts and these were shared among all staff including the Pharmacists.

To cut a long story, the in-house investigator was dismissed, the staff arrested received compensation.

 

[DRHysted]

Most of the H&S stuff comes as a result of COMAH legislation. Needless to say there’s a lot of H&S where I work, and as far as I’m concerned it’s necessary. Foreign lorry drivers tend to have a different view however.

 

[Slick]

Recently, a couple of factories my company supplies took on a new Health & Safety Manager. An ex-army Sergeant Major, this guy quickly became something of a terror. He insisted that my company fit safety guards on over 300 tools despite there being no recorded accidents with thousands of these tools over thirty years. He ordered restrictive and inhibiting PPE for the workers and put the company to considerable expense trying to mitigate against pretty minor risks. He banned brooms and insisted hoovers be brought on to the factory floor for example, as brooms stir up airborne particles. Last week he almost caused a strike at one factory after he decided the company had to stop using MDF entirely as the dust is carcinogenic (despite the saws and routers being fitted with their own dust extraction systems). On Friday his employment was terminated.

There's obviously a place for H&S but there has to be a balance between mitigating real risk and practicality. This guy didn't know where that line was and clearly enjoyed the power trip he was on.

Anybody else ever come across this type? Any examples of H&S just being, well, silly?

I'm not reading 3 pages so apologies if this has been done but your man is spot on, especially about the Hoover.

 

[Dirk]

About 25 years ago I tackled our Chief Executive at a meeting in front of an audience of about 50 colleagues.
They had produced an H&S assessment of the Dept and had identified the single biggest cause of avoidable serious injuries caused when exercising our core duties.
The cause was well known to all involved, but this was the first time it have ever been committed to print in an official document.
I asked when a solution was going to be implemented, as a problem had been identified and it could be addressed at zero cost to the Dept.
I was told that it would be 'politically unacceptable' (HM Government) to change the current system.
So much for H&S.
I put the CE on notice that, should I be injured due to them identifying the biggest single cause of avoidable injury and refusing to address it, I would personally sue the arse off him.
He was noticeably uncomfortable and embarrassed about the situation and rapidly changed the subject.
25 years on and the problem still hasn't been addressed.
I'm glad I retired 5 years ago.
It's all ballcocks.

 

[Profpointy]

Gravity.
Stuff on top of lockers is a symptom of poor housekeeping which can lead to accidents. Why would stuff be stored on top of lockers? Insufficient safe storage places? Laziness to dispose of surplus or waste items?
Regarding the no incidents reported, no sensible person would report an incident which might make them look stupid at an accident investigation.

Semi related, but years ago a mate spotted a nice pulley wheel at work he decided to pinch for some caving related project. He'd got it in his locker awaiting a suitable opportunity to sneak it out of the factory. Unfortunately later that day he had to fetch something from the locker and the pulley wheel fell out and broke his foot. He then had to hobble around in agony pretending to be OK until his workmates could fake a plausible seeming industrial accident to explain the injury.

 

[Andy in Germany]

We had a fair bit of H+S Risk assessment training, mainly because we work with people who can't make risk assessments themselves either due to mental incapacity or psychological issues. We used a table with different factors, like potential severity of an injury, likelihood of being injured, and how often this actually happened.
The strange thing is that every time a team went out, "Driving to location" was always the most dangerous thing according to our matrix.

 

[Mr Celine]

When I worked in a DWP office there was a ban on piling stuff on top of cabinets. It had to be stored neatly on shelves to prevent injuries from falling objects.

Now I work in a cooncil office. There is a ban on using shelves for storage. This is to prevent injuries from striking heads on shelves. Stuff is just piled on top of cabinets.

I don't recall any injuries from either cause.

 

[gbb]

One of the problems I see is companies 'pushing down' responsibilities. Its a double edged sword,I can see the logic, the end user has more intimate knowledge of their environment and its risks, but the downside is they're often Inexperienced on how to deliver properly. I do the Coshh assessments and yes, I had 'training' but it wasnt specific to what I would actually do or how I would do it...so the end product is potentially less than perfect. Same with risk assessments, there just seems to be an expectation you can do them...my first question was...what am I assessing ?, what if I dont see a risk someone else might, what if I overdo it ?...but I the end, you realise you have to just get on with it, the company is seen to fulfill its obligations with the minimum of effort. This relates to my company and may not be widespread and equally, maybe I just lack confidence at first
The conclusion I might come to on a coshh or risk assessment may be quite different to how a colleague might see the same job, theres another anomaly. And so on and so on, it's never a fixed process everyone might agree with.

 

[roadrash]

some guy, for some reason, got both hands under the guillotine.......he lost all 8 fingers

doc at hospital says if you had brought them with you we could have stitched them back on...…………………………………………………………………………………………………..he said aye but I couldn't pick them up

 

[Joey Shabadoo]

One of the problems I see is companies 'pushing down' responsibilities. Its a double edged sword,I can see the logic, the end user has more intimate knowledge of their environment and its risks, but the downside is they're often Inexperienced on how to deliver properly. I do the Coshh assessments and yes, I had 'training' but it wasnt specific to what I would actually do or how I would do it...so the end product is potentially less than perfect. Same with risk assessments, there just seems to be an expectation you can do them...my first question was...what am I assessing ?, what if I dont see a risk someone else might, what if I overdo it ?...but I the end, you realise you have to just get on with it, the company is seen to fulfill its obligations with the minimum of effort. This relates to my company and may not be widespread and equally, maybe I just lack confidence at first
The conclusion I might come to on a coshh or risk assessment may be quite different to how a colleague might see the same job, theres another anomaly. And so on and so on, it's never a fixed process everyone might agree with.

I regularly get calls asking if I can supply battery tools to replace pneumatic ones. Every time I go through the same routine:

- Why do you want battery tools?
- Air hoses are a trip hazard
- Well run the hoses overhead and drop them down on spring lines
- That's far too expensive, we want battery tools
- You have over 200 tools in there. Every tool needs 1 battery being used, 1 ready for use and 1 being charged. You'll need a secure room to put 200 battery chargers as they're a fire risk - have you done a risk assessment on 600 Lithium Ion batteries on the site? You're also going to need to have the room wired up with a dedicated supply to give you that much juice. You need a system of tracking the batteries so you know what state of charge they're in and you quite possibly need a number of different battery types for different tools.
- Oh
- Or you can run the hoses overhead
- I'll get back to you.