Hardtail ...

[Yellow Saddle]

Perhaps my use of the word 'downhills' wasn't right. I meant descents .... as in fast rooty, rocky descents. With mostly fast smooth descents and trails with some jumps. Sorry for the confusion.
I do mainly XC and trails with some more technical descents and I feel like I'm not truly progressing my skills with a full suspension ?

You haven't cleared the confusion. You seem to think there's a difference in riding downhill and descending. It is the same and requires the same from a bicycle and the rider. The only extra skill you'll need when descending with a hardtail is how to brake harder so that you don't go as fast. There is no benefit to a hardtail in offroad riding. It can be done, but slower, less safe and less pleasurable.

It is a hipster thing. Stop reading those magazines and go for a ride on your current bike.

 

[FishFright]

You haven't cleared the confusion. You seem to think there's a difference in riding downhill and descending. It is the same and requires the same from a bicycle and the rider. The only extra skill you'll need when descending with a hardtail is how to brake harder so that you don't go as fast. There is no benefit to a hardtail in offroad riding. It can be done, but slower, less safe and less pleasurable.

It is a hipster thing. Stop reading those magazines and go for a ride on your current bike.

You're not often wrong YS but in this case I think you are. There is loads of fun to be gained riding a hardtail on some trails, It takes more attention and builds your skill set. Also a trail thats boring on a full bouncer is often a lark on a hard tail. The long and slack hardtail thing good fun but won't win you any races of course..

OP 120 - 140mm forks is a sweet spot for these long and slack frames so buy or build yourself one but keep the full bouncer for trial centres and more gnarly (dude) trails.
http://singletrackworld.com forum is a better place to ask about this kind of thing.

 

[fossyant]

What's your current bike ?

 

[Yellow Saddle]

You're not often wrong YS but in this case I think you are. There is loads of fun to be gained riding a hardtail on some trails, It takes more attention and builds your skill set. Also a trail thats boring on a full bouncer is often a lark on a hard tail. The long and slack hardtail thing good fun but won't win you any races of course..

OP 120 - 140mm forks is a sweet spot for these long and slack frames so buy or build yourself one but keep the full bouncer for trial centres and more gnarly (dude) trails.
http://singletrackworld.com forum is a better place to ask about this kind of thing.

Of course there's lots of fun to be had from a hardtail. I have been riding one for 28 years and raced plenty on it, from short marathons to 9-day stage races. However, the OP wants to swap from a full susser to a hardtail to ride trails that require big impacts and fast descents. So big that he requires 160mm of fork travel and a dropper post. That's just silly. There's no additional skills t be had from doing that other than what I stated. Horses for courses, but that's the wrong horse for the course.
I just don't get it.

 

[Flyboy]

Orange Crush it has to be

 

[BretonM]

You haven't cleared the confusion. You seem to think there's a difference in riding downhill and descending. It is the same and requires the same from a bicycle and the rider. The only extra skill you'll need when descending with a hardtail is how to brake harder so that you don't go as fast. There is no benefit to a hardtail in offroad riding. It can be done, but slower, less safe and less pleasurable.

It is a hipster thing. Stop reading those magazines and go for a ride on your current bike.

That's the whole point of my post ... i am not enjoying my rides on my full suspension as much as i did on my previous hardtails. I didn't come here to have my grammatical flaws pointed out or told that my opinion is wrong. I came here for good advice about hardtails and suggestions of good ones

 

[BretonM]

What's your current bike ?

Highly upgraded GIANT NRS from about 2005.

 

[Crackle]

Long travel hard tails are all the rage. Check out Whyte, Orange, Cotic, Ragley, On One, Ghost, Bird etc... 2K will pretty much get you any of them. Quite a few have bought Bird's and have been very pleased with them.

https://www.bird.bike/

 

[BretonM]

Orange Crush it has to be

Is the crush an aluminium frame ?

 

[BretonM]

Long travel hard tails are all the rage. Check out Whyte, Orange, Cotic, Ragley, On One, Ghost, Bird etc... 2K will pretty much get you any of them. Quite a few have bought Bird's and have been very pleased with them.

https://www.bird.bike/

I am surprised you can get a hardtail with SRAM Eagle for little over 2000 !!!

 

[Crackle]

I am surprised you can get a hardtail with SRAM Eagle for little over 2000 !!!

Well I did say 'pretty much', that might be the exception.

 

[Kajjal]

To give a comparison my xc hard tail has 100mm air forks and will handle anything I choose to ride such as forestry single track, fireroads, by ways, birdleways, canal towpaths etc. It climbs and descends very well. I am on strava the second fastest on a local off road downhill where I hit about 40mph, this did take a bit of practice to get the hang of. The bike goes over rocky trails fine until they turn into an endless rock garden and then it is no fun.

My Gravel bike is even faster off road on smoother less technical trails as it weighs less and accelerates a lot faster. But again once things get rough you take a real beating and this is when the xc mountain bike flies. on the upside the gravel bike is much faster on the road in between the off road sections.

For jumps taking off and landing a hardtail properly is a lot harder and even when you get it right you still feel it more than a FS bike. I once took a previous xc hardtail down a downhill course and it was really hard work, luckily there were no huge jumps or I would probably not be here now

 

[Jason945]

I had a Cotic Solaris with Pikes up front and loved it, circumstances forced me to sell it but I would recommend Cotic, Stanton, Bird etc, even Sanderson now have a 29er and there is a lovely Curtis currently for sale on ST, Curtis, more XC than aggressive though.
If your not overly tall Pipedream are doing these cheap and you could have an almost dream build for £2k.

 

[BretonM]

To give a comparison my xc hard tail has 100mm air forks and will handle anything I choose to ride such as forestry single track, fireroads, by ways, birdleways, canal towpaths etc. It climbs and descends very well. I am on strava the second fastest on a local off road downhill where I hit about 40mph, this did take a bit of practice to get the hang of. The bike goes over rocky trails fine until they turn into an endless rock garden and then it is no fun.

My Gravel bike is even faster off road on smoother less technical trails as it weighs less and accelerates a lot faster. But again once things get rough you take a real beating and this is when the xc mountain bike flies. on the upside the gravel bike is much faster on the road in between the off road sections.

For jumps taking off and landing a hardtail properly is a lot harder and even when you get it right you still feel it more than a FS bike. I once took a previous xc hardtail down a downhill course and it was really hard work, luckily there were no huge jumps or I would probably not be here now

Well if that's the case then I think a hardtail is for me no matter what others say.
You get a lot more bang for your buck with hardtails and it's seems to me that if a bike with 100mm of travel can just about handle anything you throw at it, then a bike with a 140 + should be more than enough.
Of course your skill as a rider is much more important than your bike and it sounds to me that you have plenty of skill.

I mainly ride trails in the local area and at hamsterly Forrest.

Thanks for the advice man !!!

 

[User32269]

Rigid 80s & 90s steel is where it's at man.