Fuel Price Protests

[Crackle]

No one did a 90 mile round trip for weekly shopping until petrol became as cheap (in relative terms) as it is now. Petrol became cheaper, people travelled further to shop , local shops and travelling shops closed down, people then "had" to travel further to shop.
When petrol becomes expensive the whole process could go into reverse.

Did that happen? Was it cheaper fuel or the demise of the local shop and the growth of the supermarket and the choice it offered. I think local shops will only work if they sell local produce as well. What's the point of me using the local shop to get my eggs when they come from even further away than the supermarket eggs and yet there are small egg producers all around me, including goose eggs. I never see them in my local shop, nor the locally produced organic veg and all the local seafood goes to France in a bloody big truck - the world has gone mad.

I am also not of the opinion that we need to usher in the end of the motor car, more that the type of personal transport we use needs to evolve as well and it needs to start with their being some alternatives to having to use that 'personal transport', only then will incentives to make us do that, work.

 

[snorri]

Did that happen? Was it cheaper fuel or the demise of the local shop and the growth of the supermarket and the choice it offered.

I believe it did. Supermarkets would not have gained such a large market share if customers did not have access to cheap private transport. Where will you see a supermarket without a huge car park? (ok, maybe you will in London or other areas of high population density)
I would not want to see the end of the car for private transport, but it would make for a more pleasant environment if we all had to pause and consider before using it.

 

[Crackle]

...I would not want to see the end of the car for private transport, but it would make for a more pleasant environment if we all had to pause and consider before using it.

No nor me but I would like to see it evolve, from a fossil fuel guzzler with a high energy manufacturing process and pedestrian/wildlife unfriendly design into something slightly more utilitarian and eco-friendly backed up by a public transport system that doesn't take the piss and the only way to achieve the latter folks is for it to be state run and accept it must run at a loss. Do we expect the roads to make money? i.e. road A costs x billion to make but is not expected to return a direct profit, unlike say a rail line. Instead the wider economic benefits are measured, I don't see why that logic doesn't apply to other forms of public transport infrastructure too. No-one is going to seriously get me out of my car when I can take my family of four to London and back for less than half the cost of the train and quicker!

 

[andygates]

True dat. High fuel prices could mean the death of the traditional out-of-town Tesco and the rise of nasty little personal local shops!

(Differential fuel pricing already causes trouble - Euro drivers filling up on the continental side of the tunnel, and Northern Irish drivers popping south for a tankful)

 

[cannondale boy]

I like it when people say "i don't have a car, so they can put prices up if they like". Bulls**it, even if you don't have a car, the knock on affect will be on the other side. When you go to do your shopping and you realise that it no longer costs 50p for that loaf of bread but 60p. I sold my car a month ago, and to be perfectly honest i think i made the right move, as higher petrol prices have come in to place. Six months ago the price of unleaded was 89.9, now its around 1.02 CRAZY . Public transport is a joke, even when petrol has only went up 10%, your train fares have went up say 14%, its a rip off. For some of us we need a car, for some not. I wish someone could make a car thats cheap enough to suit one person not five...tell me how many drivers do you see on the road carrying more than one passenger, probably 1 in 10 cars. Oh yes and as for a 90 mile trip to your local tescos , you live to FAR, so move house if possible.

 

[tdr1nka]

In the cities, and I stress in cities, we have to start picking apart and question the inailable right of the individual to own and operate private transport on the scale and fueled the way we see it today.

The drivers I am generalising about drive mid range cars with no other passengers or cargo, family cars and small business vehicles don't count.

Drivers won't use busses over cars because busses can be expensive, don't run on time, and are full of other people they might have to sit next to.

The inside out chicken and egg side to this problem is the driver saying, 'I'd use Public Transport if only it suited me more' and the fact that Public Transport can only be improved by more people using it(aside from the fact it needs to be Govt. susidised and not run for profit).

This sadly leaves the ball in the drivers court most of who are not prone to alturism.

T x

 

[Crackle]

Oh yes and as for a 90 mile trip to your local tescos , you live to FAR, so move house if possible.

I could move to the town and commute 90 miles to my job instead

 

[LLB]

I could move to the town and commute 90 miles to my job instead

You mean like User482

 

[Crackle]

You mean like User482

...he's probably carbon offsetting it though

 

[LLB]

...he's probably carbon offsetting it though

Is that like paying someone to drive out into the middle of nowhere in a 5mpg Unimog and plant a tree on your behalf whilst you knock up mega mileage in a 50 litre diesel loco

 

[Terminator]

That's a strange message board name.

 

[LLB]

That's a strange message board name.

What User482 ? I thought it myself a few times, but hey ho

 

[andygates]

I like it when people say "i don't have a car, so they can put prices up if they like".

I do drive. They can still put up the prices if they like. It'll get me riding more, and driving less on those days when I'm just being a wuss. Only a pocketbook attack will cut consumption. Your shopping and my shopping will both go up. If I drive less, I still win.

Six months ago the price of unleaded was 89.9, now its around 1.02 CRAZY .

Yeah, starting a war in the middle east, china going industrimental, who could have predicted that, eh? And people still move further away from work for those chocolate box views...

 

[LLB]

I do drive. They can still put up the prices if they like. It'll get me riding more, and driving less on those days when I'm just being a wuss. Only a pocketbook attack will cut consumption. Your shopping and my shopping will both go up. If I drive less, I still win.



Yeah, starting a war in the middle east, china going industrimental, who could have predicted that, eh? And people still move further away from work for those chocolate box views...

The Industrialisation of China has been made possible due to a lack of basic human rights, and the blind eye which the west uses when setting import quotas

 

[GrahamG]

This is just a result of becoming too accustomed to years of deflating prices of consumer goods (all those things which need to be transported by lorry, including food) and below inflation increases in the cost of motoring. Food is cheaper than ever before, consumer goods are cheaper than ever before, the cost of motoring is cheaper than ever before (this is in relation to income which has been steadily inflating the whole time) - we've never had it so good as in the last 10 years!

All of a sudden prices start to increase and people start throwing their toys out of the pram, despite the fact that disposable income is pretty much higher than ever. Economic cycles etc. we're overdue a bust after an excessive amount of Gordon Brown's boom.

The arguments regarding those in remote rural areas and are entirely valid but there are mechanisms that could be used to redress that balance somewhat.