First self driving (reported) fatality

[winjim]

Yes, like the development of the automobile that kills tens of thousands every year.... and we still have not learned anything since we removed the man with the flag.

Heard a discussion about this on R4 the other day. First pedestrian fatality caused by a car was 1896 or thereabouts. Hit by a car at 4mph. The coroner at the time said it must never be allowed to happen again.

Interviewee said, and I paraphrase, at that point we could have decided to stop development of the motor vehicle but we've basically decided as a society to accept a certain amount of collateral damage.

 

[confusedcyclist]

Yes death by car is socially acceptable... but not everywhere. https://usa.streetsblog.org/2013/02...op-murdering-children-street-safety-movement/

That video is shocking, that's exactly the kind of collision you would expect an automated vehicle should prevent.

 

[Fab Foodie]

Heard a discussion about this on R4 the other day. First pedestrian fatality caused by a car was 1896 or thereabouts. Hit by a car at 4mph. The coroner at the time said it must never be allowed to happen again.

Interviewee said, and I paraphrase, at that point we could have decided to stop development of the motor vehicle but we've basically decided as a society to accept a certain amount of collateral damage.

Exactly.

 

[Jody]

Here is the dash cam video, dash cams are way worse than human eyes at dealing with low light situations,

Agreed. I think the camera footage is a cop out. They should show the footage taken from the infa red and night vision as the car must be equipped with it.

When I look at my dash cam footage from night there is so much it doesnt pick up that I did.

 

[snorri]

A two part video has now been released......
https://www.theguardian.com/technol...lf-driving-crash-that-killed-woman-in-arizona

 

[jefmcg]

It's youtube, so ...

WARNING: it stops a millisecond before a fatal collision, so think carefully before you click.

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=13&v=RASBcc4yOOo

 

[deptfordmarmoset]

A two part video has now been released......
https://www.theguardian.com/technol...lf-driving-crash-that-killed-woman-in-arizona

That's the first one I saw.

''... skeptics have pointed out that the industry is entering a dangerous phase while the cars aren’t yet fully autonomous, but human operators aren’t fully engaged.''
​

So the car's not really driving itself, the passenger behind the wheel isn't. Next question: what's driving it?

 

[PK99]

I wonder how they've told the car to interpret the rules of the road. If they've programmed it according to Arizona law then it won't be expecting to see a pedestrian outside a crossing, or will at least expect to have right of way over them.
.

....and if it had been a deer or other wild animal?

The programming should avoid any hazard in the road.

 

[winjim]

Agreed. I think the camera footage is a cop out. They should show the footage taken from the infa red and night vision as the car must be equipped with it.

When I look at my dash cam footage from night there is so much it doesnt pick up that I did.

It's not even footage as such that's needed. It's raw data from the sensors and information on how the car interprets and reacts to that data, how it's been programmed etc.

I am of course being massively cynical when I suggest it may be liable to ignore jaywalking pedestrians, but I wonder how transparent they'll be when it comes to disclosing their software.

 

[Ming the Merciless]

It is shocking. That situation is basically the most simple one you could have for avoiding an accident. There are no confounding factors, no complexity, the setup is not fit to be used on the roads.

 

[Bazzer]

That's the first one I saw.

''... skeptics have pointed out that the industry is entering a dangerous phase while the cars aren’t yet fully autonomous, but human operators aren’t fully engaged.''
​

So the car's not really driving itself, the passenger behind the wheel isn't. Next question: what's driving it?

Hmm, I think a good starting point would be to get human operators in non autonomous cars fully engaged.

I do also find myself wondering about the selection process for the operator/s. With something as important, both in terms of potentially future transport and people's lives on the road being trialled, I would be wanting to make sure the operators were fully engaged with the experiment and appreciated the attention a fatality or injury was likely to bring. Clearly with the operator seemingly on a mobile device, that selection process has failed.

 

[Spinney]

I do also find myself wondering about the selection process for the operator/s. With something as important, both in terms of potentially future transport and people's lives on the road being trialled, I would be wanting to make sure the operators were fully engaged with the experiment and appreciated the attention a fatality or injury was likely to bring. Clearly with the operator seemingly on a mobile device, that selection process has failed.

They should have the equivalent of a test pilot in there, noting what he/she would have done/observed in all the situations encountered.
Not the equivalent of a lager lout on a charter flight.

 

[jarlrmai]

Hmm, I think a good starting point would be to get human operators in non autonomous cars fully engaged.

I do also find myself wondering about the selection process for the operator/s. With something as important, both in terms of potentially future transport and people's lives on the road being trialled, I would be wanting to make sure the operators were fully engaged with the experiment and appreciated the attention a fatality or injury was likely to bring. Clearly with the operator seemingly on a mobile device, that selection process has failed.

It's not about the person it's about the situation unless your hands are on the wheel and feet on the pedals you cannot react like a human driver, you are not mentally or physically engaged because you are not having to plan ahead or be primed to use your instinct during the process of driving.

Obviously yes in this instance they were clearly distracted by a phone as well which is even worse but it demonstrates they either need to be really actually self driving or not on the roads at all.

 

[Bazzer]

It's not about the person it's about the situation unless your hands are on the wheel and feet on the pedals you cannot react like a human driver, you are not mentally or physically engaged because you are not having to plan ahead or be primed to use your instinct during the process of driving.

Obviously yes in this instance they were clearly distracted by a phone as well which is even worse but it demonstrates they either need to be really actually self driving or not on the roads at all.

True, but if you are engaged in the process, an incident might have been avoided or mitigated. Otherwise WTF was the purpose of the operator?

A view here about the some of the technical gadgetry carried by the vehicle.

 

[jarlrmai]

The purpose of the operator is what you think however it is ineffective, is just a legal requirement that has never come under proper scrutiny.