Cyclist's death may have been caused by listening to music on her phone

[Dan B]

Anyway as others have said, I will not click on a daily mail link as it is literally giving money to a racist hate-filled rag. And even for right-of-centre politics folk, remember that hatred is frequently directed at cyclists

That's when it's not being directed at the rule of law, or at the Austrians who recently voted against a neo-Nazi

 

[Profpointy]

That's when it's not being directed at the rule of law, or at the Austrians who recently voted against a neo-Nazi

That's strange; they used to look quite favourably on a certain Austrian back in the day.

 

[Pale Rider]

That's strange; they used to look quite favourably on a certain Austrian back in the day.

Yawn.

Where were we?

Ah yes, an inquest into the death of a cyclist.

Looks to me as if the cyclist entered the roundabout on the nearside of the lorry, using it as cover.

She then took a tumble for no apparent reason, although it could have been no more than a slippery road surface.

Routinely, such a fall would cause minor injuries at worst,

But occasionally impacts to the head are fatal.

Lots of cases around the country of 'single punch' manslaughter.

The victim is struck a non-fatal blow but one which is strong enough to cause him to lose balance.

Death is caused by the victim's head hitting the pavement.

Once again, 99 times out of 100 when someone is knocked over they wouldn't even hit their head, let alone suffer a fatal impact.

But occasionally it will end badly.

 

[jefmcg]

I must say, if I listen to music while cycling, it does block out the surrounding. It's not the sound, per se, it's something that happens in my head. I get involved in the music and stop paying attention around me. It does not happen while driving and it does not happen with talk. So - duh! - I don't listen to music while cycling, but happily listen to podcasts.

I'm not saying this applies here, in fact I don't think it does. She was an adult and an experienced cyclist. If she zoned out with music the way I do, I'm sure she wouldn't have listened to it. And we don't even know if she was listening to anything.

Normally I am as against the Daily Mail as anyone, but this example seems to be a perfectly acceptable article, publishing something in public interest that no one else seems to have published. The last article about this collision on the Yorkshire Post site is calling it a hit and run where the driver speed away. Clicking this article is probably ok, and may even be a good thing, leading to more actual journalism on the site, rather than commentary on youtube clips and important celebrity side-boob updates.

 

[Accy cyclist]

Where has this thread been moved to? I can't seem to find it in https://www.cyclechat.net/forums/general-cycling-discussions.55/

 

[Dayvo]

I'm sorry about the death of anyone but I refuse to read anything in the Daily Mail. Its reporting is usually pure fantasy. If I feel any need for that genre, I'll read Lewis Carroll instead. He was a better writer.

As indeed is Andy Carroll, I suspect.

This article completely lacks credibility. Every comment is made to imply that the cyclist was TOTALLY at fault:

may have been distracted by listening to music

She had entered a roundabout without looking right really?

Ms Norton, who was wearing her headphones at the time of her tragic crash, was not wearing a helmet and a helmet would have saved her?

Coroner Paul Marks ruled listening to music could have been a distraction

He also said her injuries may have been lessened if she had worn a helmet.

Eyewitness Martin Ward said: 'From what I saw she did not appear to look left or right as she entered the roundabout.

A police accident investigator found the cycle had a defective front brake which touched the handlebar - which could have been a manufacturing fault - as the cable outer was cut short.

The cycle also had no front reflector and a loose bell on the handlebars which was missing a bolt. is that at all relevant?

Coroner Paul Marks told the inquest he found that Ms Norton went on to the roundabout without looking right and was seemingly unaware of the HGV.

He said because of a fitting defect in the front brake caused by the cable being too short, she may have applied the rear brake causing a skid.

He continued: 'I cannot determine if she was on her iPhone listening with earphone at the time, but if she had been, it could have caused a distraction and could have contributed to the cause of the accident.'

He said the fact she was not wearing a helmet may have meant she had suffered worse injuries,

Every highlighted comment above is speculation, conjecture and assumption.

Piss-poor, one-sided 'journalism.'

 

[Accy cyclist]

Scroll up to the top and you can see where you are.

Oh right, i've found it.

 

[smutchin]

Looks to me as if the cyclist entered the roundabout on the nearside of the lorry, using it as cover.

First part is how I interpreted it too, but there's no evidence to infer 'using it as cover' from the report. I'm also not convinced by the eyewitness account that she didn't look right before entering the roundabout.

What's also not clear is the relative positions of the bike and the lorry on the approach to the roundabout. If the cyclist was moving along at normal cycling speeds, and the lorry was moving at normal motor traffic speeds, then for them both to arrive at the roundabout at the same time suggests the lorry had been behind the bike and was overtaking when the incident happened.

So how did the lorry driver not know there was a cyclist sharing the road space? Had he not seen the cyclist ahead of him on the approach to the roundabout?

 

[mjr]

Looks to me as if the cyclist entered the roundabout on the nearside of the lorry, using it as cover.

That seems improbable - it looks far more likely to me that the lorry probably overtook a cyclist on the entry to the roundabout, probably encroaching on a hatched area to do so - three of the arms of that roundabout have hatching on the right-hand side of the entry in a futile cheapskate attempt to discourage motorists overtaking cycles and motorcycles like that. The angles look so shallow that if a lorry is there first and in its lane, there shouldn't be space for a cyclist to overtake on its left. EDIT: this interpretation is contradicted by the road.cc report linked below.

Roundabout is of an old dangerous design. Redesign roundabout ASAP... oh sorry, we're not a country with Sustainable Safety or Vision Zero, so let's just blame the cyclist because it's cheaper.

 

[PK99]

http://road.cc/content/news/213510-listening-music-iphone-may-have-led-cyclists-death-says-coroner

Extract:

Keen cyclist Emily Norton, 38, entered a roundabout without looking right at the same time as a DAF HGV lorry was exiting the roundabout and may have panicked trying to avoid a collision, Hull Coroners’ Court heard.

 

[smutchin]

Keen cyclist Emily Norton, 38, entered a roundabout without looking right at the same time as a DAF HGV lorry was exiting the roundabout and may have panicked trying to avoid a collision, Hull Coroners’ Court heard.

That's clearer and makes more sense than the DM report. And does more or less absolve the lorry driver of any blame.

 

[mjr]

http://road.cc/content/news/213510-listening-music-iphone-may-have-led-cyclists-death-says-coroner

Extract:

Keen cyclist Emily Norton, 38, entered a roundabout without looking right at the same time as a DAF HGV lorry was exiting the roundabout and may have panicked trying to avoid a collision, Hull Coroners’ Court heard.

So now we've two reports which disagree with each other! I assume the road.cc one is original reporting, but there's neither author named nor source cited.

The road.cc report also differs in that it says "[Coroner Paul Marks] said because of a fitting defect in the front brake caused by the cable being too short, she may have applied the rear brake causing a skid, adding that at no point did witnesses see the two vehicles make contact" which still doesn't make sense. Is there ANY type of brake where a too-short cable wouldn't result in it being permanently on?

 

[PK99]

[QUOTE 4585590, member: 9609"]I am understanding it as both the lorry and the cyclist were on the same road approaching the roundabout ? It sounds a bit like the lorry has got too close for comfort and the poor cyclist has maybe moved a bit to the left, come off and very very unluckily received fatal injuries. Presumably the lorry never made contact with her and with no one saying he was too close to the cyclist it is very difficult to appoint any blame.

I'm always very mindful when approaching such a roundabout on the bike that anyone coming up behind me maybe devoting too much concentration on traffic coming from the right that they may not notice me.[/QUOTE]

not according to the report on road.cc linked and quoted just above. That reads that the HGV was on the roundabout and the cyclist approached from a different direction and failed to give way

 

[Pale Rider]

As indeed is Andy Carroll, I suspect.

This article completely lacks credibility. Every comment is made to imply that the cyclist was TOTALLY at fault:

may have been distracted by listening to music

She had entered a roundabout without looking right really?

Ms Norton, who was wearing her headphones at the time of her tragic crash, was not wearing a helmet and a helmet would have saved her?

Coroner Paul Marks ruled listening to music could have been a distraction

He also said her injuries may have been lessened if she had worn a helmet.

Eyewitness Martin Ward said: 'From what I saw she did not appear to look left or right as she entered the roundabout.

A police accident investigator found the cycle had a defective front brake which touched the handlebar - which could have been a manufacturing fault - as the cable outer was cut short.

The cycle also had no front reflector and a loose bell on the handlebars which was missing a bolt. is that at all relevant?

Coroner Paul Marks told the inquest he found that Ms Norton went on to the roundabout without looking right and was seemingly unaware of the HGV.

He said because of a fitting defect in the front brake caused by the cable being too short, she may have applied the rear brake causing a skid.

He continued: 'I cannot determine if she was on her iPhone listening with earphone at the time, but if she had been, it could have caused a distraction and could have contributed to the cause of the accident.'

He said the fact she was not wearing a helmet may have meant she had suffered worse injuries,

Every highlighted comment above is speculation, conjecture and assumption.

Piss-poor, one-sided 'journalism.'

Usual shoot the messenger garbage.

You should direct your ire at the coroner who said: "'I accept this was an entirely avoidable incident and the cause of the events that lead up to the accident rest entirely with the cyclist.

'No charges have been brought against the HGV driver and he has been totally exonerated.'

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...istening-music-earphones-caused-accident.html





Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...-earphones-caused-accident.html#ixzz4RzRiRnVu
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[jefmcg]

The road cc article is plagarised DM article

How shaming
DM

Eyewitness Martin Ward said: 'From what I saw she did not appear to look left or right as she entered the roundabout. The cyclist kept in a straight line.

'The wagon kept in a straight line. I saw the cyclist lift in the air and go on to the verge. The way the road is they were converging. In my opinion the wagon driver did not do anything wrong.'

PC Sally Acomb said a full accident investigation had taken place and Mr Lamb was not facing any charges.

A police accident investigator found the cycle had a defective front brake which touched the handlebar - which could have been a manufacturing fault - as the cable outer was cut short.

road cc

Eyewitness Martin Ward, of Howden said: “From what I saw she did not appear to look left or right as she entered the roundabout.

“The cyclist kept in a straight line. The wagon kept in a straight line. I saw the cyclist lift in the air and go on to the verge. The way the road is they were converging. In my opinion the wagon driver did not do anything wrong.”

PC Sally Acomb said a full accident investigation had taken place and the lorry driver was not facing any charges. A police accident investigator found the cycle had a defective from brake which touch the handlebar – which could have been a manufacturing fault – as the cable outer was cut short.