"Cycling Mikey" loses court case.

[T4tomo]

I mean no disrespect but I'm not a fan of attributing motivations to someone.

When we do that it is very difficult to assess their actions without applying that bias.

fair point

 

[boydj]

I think my worry is that his "behaviour" will further prejudice driver's attitudes towards cyclists and some poor minding his / her own business cyclist will be on the wrong end of a driver who he has p-ssed off.

You think drivers who think nothing of going the wrong-side of a keep-left sign are likely to have a good attitude to cyclists' safety? They certainly care nothing for pedestrian safety, which is the major problem with wrong-side driving since pedestrians could easily step into the path of such a driver while looking the other way.

 

[Deleted User]

Get your arse to spoonies in Wolverhampton on a Saturday night if you want to see some direct confrontation!

 

[Cycleops]

Get your arse to spoonies in Wolverhampton on a Saturday night if you want to see some direct confrontation!

I think I'll pass on that.

 

[BoldonLad]

Sorry, it's not clear to me what you mean.

Are you suggesting that most policing is done by citizen cameras or Police cameras?

Yes, Police or local authority Cameras. Traffic Police, or, indeed, police "on the beat", or, in "Panda Cars" are almost totally absent from our streets.

I recently drove what I think is a significant distance in the UK, (approximately 850 miles, in two days), mostly on motorways or "A" roads. My recollection is that I did not see a single Police Patrol, but, I must have passed dozens of cameras.

 

[boydj]

I'm not aware of any police force who has done so.

They give their support to people who video offences and submit that video.

I'm not aware of any police force who support people confronting those who are committing offences.

I don't agree that he is cowardly as Shep suggests, but I have always said that I do not agree with his confrontational stance. Take videos and submit them, absolutely. Take the law into your own hands by stopping them continuing, no.

CM has had literally hundreds of people given points and fines for their behaviour at Gandalf Corner and elsewhere. The Met police and other forces are very supportive of camera cyclists - with a few notable exceptions. It's an easy win for them as most drivers, having seen the film, will plead guilty with the occasional expensive lawyer being brought in to wiggle their client out of the charges.

It takes a lot of guts to do what CM does. I find it amazing that so many drivers are prepared to break the law in such a blatantly dangerous way.

 

[boydj]

I'd love to meet this pr*ck without his camera in a dark side street, doubt this would ever happen though.

Ooh, you're so 'ard - behind a keyboard. Or are you really an aggressive idiot?

 

[Dag Hammar]

There has been much discussion in earlier comments regarding ‘guilty’ and ‘innocent’.
Below is copied and pasted and may be of interest for people that take an interest in law.
The 'third verdict' of 'not proven' is unique to the Scottish courts. It allows juries to express misgivings about the accused's innocence, while accepting that the prosecution has not made its case 'beyond all reasonable doubt'.

 

[HobbesOnTour]

Yes, Police or local authority Cameras. Traffic Police, or, indeed, police "on the beat", or, in "Panda Cars" are almost totally absent from our streets.

I recently drove what I think is a significant distance in the UK, (approximately 850 miles, in two days), mostly on motorways or "A" roads. My recollection is that I did not see a single Police Patrol, but, I must have passed dozens of cameras.

I do wonder how effective such a system is for preventing repeat offending other than the application of points on a license.

My gut tells me that there's a significant section of the population that would respond more "positively" to a human interaction. And that's where Mikey comes in.
I don't mean that drivers react positively towards him but I'd imagine a lot of them no longer cut that corner. That's a positive.

That's completely separate to the overall visibility of Police as a deterrent for crime.

 

[PK99]

There has been much discussion in earlier comments regarding ‘guilty’ and ‘innocent’.
Below is copied and pasted and may be of interest for people that take an interest in law.
The 'third verdict' of 'not proven' is unique to the Scottish courts. It allows juries to express misgivings about the accused's innocence, while accepting that the prosecution has not made its case 'beyond all reasonable doubt'.

Scotland's controversial not proven verdict is set to be abolished under a new bill to be considered by MSPs.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-62811085

Same link:
Despite being available in all Scottish criminal cases there is no definition of the not proven verdict, or the difference between it and a not guilty verdict.
The legal implications of a not proven verdict are exactly the same as a not guilty verdict - the accused is acquitted and is innocent in the eyes of the law

 

[classic33]

The jury returns a not proven verdict because they believe the person is guilty, but the evidence did not prove this beyond a reasonable doubt.


https://www.gov.scot/publications/not-proven-verdict-related-reforms-consultation-analysis/pages/3/

 

[Alex321]

CM has had literally hundreds of people given points and fines for their behaviour at Gandalf Corner and elsewhere. The Met police and other forces are very supportive of camera cyclists - with a few notable exceptions. It's an easy win for them as most drivers, having seen the film, will plead guilty with the occasional expensive lawyer being brought in to wiggle their client out of the charges.

Which is basically agreeing with what I said - "They give their support to people who video offences and submit that video."

It takes a lot of guts to do what CM does. I find it amazing that so many drivers are prepared to break the law in such a blatantly dangerous way.

It does take guts. But that still doesn't make blocking the road "right".

 

[boydj]

It does take guts. But that still doesn't make blocking the road "right".

A lot of awareness has been raised on the problems at that corner through CM's actions. Almost certainly fewer drivers cut the corner and there are fewer accidents than before Mikey started doing what he does.

Where do you draw the line when intervening on witnessing a crime?

Clearly CM should not have to do what he does, but in the absence of effective prevention by the council responsible for that area, something needs to happen.

 

[lazybloke]

You genuinely think of this Mikey character as an 'educator '?

FFS he's nothing more than an egotistical pr*ck with too much time on his hands and out to make a name for himself.

I bet you've got a laminated A4 picture of him under your pillow.

So if you were caught on camera by Mikey, you'd react how? Swear at him, lamp him, remain in denial at your own lawbreaking?

CM's approach is v confrontational, and would be copied by few on here, but some of us understand his motivations, and he does get results.

A more passive approach of filming from the roadside might not provide clear identification of the driver, and certainly wouldn't leave a lasting impression on the driver.

So yes, I genuinely think Mikey provides education. Some drivers are too thick/stubborn to learn, unfortunately.

 

[Alex321]

A lot of awareness has been raised on the problems at that corner through CM's actions. Almost certainly fewer drivers cut the corner and there are fewer accidents than before Mikey started doing what he does.

Where do you draw the line when intervening on witnessing a crime?

Clearly CM should not have to do what he does, but in the absence of effective prevention by the council responsible for that area, something needs to happen.

Unless it is a crime punishable by more than 6 months in prison (which is the limit for when a citizen's arrest is legal), I draw the line at recording and reporting it.

Maybe yelling at somebody. But blocking the road is technically another crime, and I was always taught that two wrongs don't make a right.

As I have said every time he has come up here, I fully support him videoing the incidents and sending the videos to the police. I disagree strongly with his confrontational actions which are of very questionable legality.