Critérium du Dauphiné 2-9 June [spoilers]

[Pedrosanchezo]

Not to mention people having different objectives and races unfolding differently. Any comparisons would be meaningless.

Plus there was all those drugs back then.

 

[VamP]

Plus there was all those drugs back then.

Sounds just like being at uni.

 

[400bhp]

Even if you have that data, you can't make a meaningful comparison because climbs appear at different points in the race from year to year - both within stages and within the race overall.

I was waiting for someone to pick up on that, but with enough data (power and weight for one) meaningful comparisons can be made.

 

[montage]

What is that latest from David Walsh?

 

[Noodley]

What is that latest from David Walsh?

He says that he thinks you're a nobber.

 

[smutchin]

@DavidWalsh: Enjoying life on the Death Star. Tell you what, Sir Dave mixes a shoot-hot vodka martini. Just seen Kiryienka snorting coke off a podium girl's tits. Feckin' A.

 

[The Couch]

Just seen Kiryienka snorting coke off a podium girl's tits

That's about as close that he's going to get to the podium anyway (riding for Sky)
So at least, he can make it count

 

[GilesM]

I was working just outside Grenoble last week, didn't get to see the race due to my work, but this lot all appeared at my Hotel on the Friday evening, very impressive to see close up.

 

[lukesdad]

Indeed.
My point, and also made by other CCers, is that the style and results of Sky, Froome and Wiggins makes it an easy, lazy comparison with USPS.

The comparison with USPS, is quite frightening. I would of thought the emergence of another dominant super team would be quite worrying to those wishing to clean up pro racing and not for the reason that the super team would be using the drugs.

 

[Flying_Monkey]

Even if you have that data, you can't make a meaningful comparison because climbs appear at different points in the race from year to year - both within stages and within the race overall.

It's quite easy to generate comparable power output figures - even with the changes to where any particular climb appears in a stage, averaged across a whole GT you can get a meaningful data set, and you can do this retrospectively too. And the figures I have seen, for example for Nibali at the Giro this year compared to previous winners from 5 or 10 years ago, show that the average power output on climbs race was well within the bounds of what is possible unaided. For many previous years, less so. I haven't seen such an analysis on Froome at the Dauphiné yet but I would be surprised if it didn't show something similar. The peloton is slower, less powerful and even many 'outstanding' performances are, when analysed like this, not superhuman at all - they are simply outstanding within what is possible. The cynics just see a rider winning or 'dominating' and think that's evidence enough for them, but the context is really important.

 

[smutchin]

It's quite easy to generate comparable power output figures - even with the changes to where any particular climb appears in a stage, averaged across a whole GT you can get a meaningful data set, and you can do this retrospectively too.

Apologies to 400bhp if I've just completely misunderstood him, but I thought he was talking about comparing individual performances on particular climbs, without that context.

 

[Flying_Monkey]

Apologies to 400bhp if I've just completely misunderstood him, but I thought he was talking about comparing individual performances on particular climbs, without that context.

Probably. I was really just making a more general point rather than specifically criticizing anyone.

 

[Noodley]

I was working just outside Grenoble last week, didn't get to see the race due to my work, but this lot all appeared at my Hotel on the Friday evening, very impressive to see close up.

Astana, Movistar and Saxo - the dark forces sharing 'preparation'?

 

[GilesM]

Astana, Movistar and Saxo - the dark forces sharing 'preparation'?

I didn't have the bottle to ask the cooks in Saxo Bank's kitchen truck if they had any of Mr Contador's special meat.

 

[400bhp]

Apologies to 400bhp if I've just completely misunderstood him, but I thought he was talking about comparing individual performances on particular climbs, without that context.

Well, yes and no. My point was there should be something publicly available (and endorsed) that shows something that is broadly comparable. I understand it's difficult to do for an individual up one climb on a particular day, so you combine groups of data and use model points instead.

I've got this broad idea in my mind that the powers that be in any sport could harness the available data they have and set trigger points to investigate possible individuals that are up to no good.