Cracks in rim?

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DWM

Well-Known Member
Hi

Pumping my tyres this morning I noticed what appear to be cracks around a few of the spoke holes on the rear wheel. The wheels are Pro Lite Revo's bought earlier this year, and have probably covered less than 1500 miles.

I have contacted Wiggle and am waiting for a response. In the meantime, do people think they are OK to continue using (for commuting, on the road)?

Many thanks.

Dave
 

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ianrauk

Tattooed Beat Messiah
Location
Rides Ti2
Personally, I wouldn't.
 

davidphilips

Phil Pip
Location
Onabike
look a bit like mavic cpx22 rims or very similar, with the cpx 22 they seem to have some that can last for seeming ever and others that seem to crack very quickly at the spoke holes, as ianrauk said best not to use , never known any to fail but the cracks can only get worse and it is a safety issue i would not use them.
 
Location
Loch side.
Rims have a finite life but their life is shorter if fewer spokes are used. This is because less spokes require higher spoke tension, giving a higher base overlay of stress in the rim, before the cyclical stresses from riding come into play.

Eventually the cracks will develop enough to relax the spokes and put the wheel out of true. Until then, it is safe to ride. They won't fail suddenly, but give you warning by wobbling badly. Even they, they'll wobble and touch the brakes so much that you can't ride - a sort of natural preventer of disaster if you want.

You're OK for now but start looking for new wheels.
 
OP
OP
D

DWM

Well-Known Member
Thanks for the comments.

As it is on the rear wheel I am relatively comfortable using them for a short while.

Rims have a finite life but their life is shorter if fewer spokes are used.

Are you therefore suggesting this is normal and not a warranty issue? The wheel is question has 32 spokes so I would have thought should be reasonably strong.

Cheers

Dave
 
Location
Loch side.
Thanks for the comments.

As it is on the rear wheel I am relatively comfortable using them for a short while.



Are you therefore suggesting this is normal and not a warranty issue? The wheel is question has 32 spokes so I would have thought should be reasonably strong.

Cheers

Dave
Finite but reasonable. If it is a 32-spoke wheel, then yours failed far too quickly, no matter how it was used. The reason seems to be poor rim design in that the extrusion encourages a crack at that location through it's poorly placed centre ridge and, the combination of dark anodizing with it. I've written here about dark anodizing before. If you are interested, you can search it.

When you take the wheel back, the retailer will say something like "that's a first for us," but somewhere there will be a pile of those rims which all failed in the same way. You are not the first. Get different wheels.
 

Tim Hall

Guest
Location
Crawley
Finite but reasonable. If it is a 32-spoke wheel, then yours failed far too quickly, no matter how it was used. The reason seems to be poor rim design in that the extrusion encourages a crack at that location through it's poorly placed centre ridge and, the combination of dark anodizing with it. I've written here about dark anodizing before. If you are interested, you can search it.

When you take the wheel back, the retailer will say something like "that's a first for us," but somewhere there will be a pile of those rims which all failed in the same way. You are not the first. Get different wheels.
The pictures suggest that there aren't any eyelets on the rim. Most/all of my wheels use eyeleted rims, but I'd be keen to know if there is any science that backs up my choice wrt rim longevity.
 
Location
Loch side.
The pictures suggest that there aren't any eyelets on the rim. Most/all of my wheels use eyeleted rims, but I'd be keen to know if there is any science that backs up my choice wrt rim longevity.

Most eyelets are cosmetic and only assist with building the wheel - eyelets being made from plated steel and this creates less friction when turning a nipple under tension than a nipple turning in naked aluminium would.

The cosmetic eyelets are so-called single eyelets which are crimped steel and only grip the exterior rim wall. I don't see how they distribute the spoke pulling stress over a larger surface area as claimed by some manufacturers. I would say if the wheelbuilding (some machines don't work well with nipple friction) method can tolerate not having eyelets, that's a better option.

Proper eyelets are sockets that engage both the inner and outer rim surface. The spoke in effect pulls on both layers and, the one layer has a hugely reduced surface area for the stress to distribute and dilute. Rims made with these eyelets and where the anodizing depth is kept to a minimum, last a very long time. Think Mavic MA2. Mavic's MA40 which was essentially the same rim but with deep anodizing and a single eyelet, lasted about a week.

Here's a single eyelet rim that failed. As I said, the eyelet does not increase the surface area of the stress region in the rim. It is exactly the same size as the nipple head.

Eyelet 1.JPG


Here's a non-eyeleted carbon wheel failing in the same mode. This is an Enve rim with a very stupid design where the internal suface in the nipple area is milled out. It is impossible to stress relieve these wheels and hence, impossible to guarantee long spoke life.

Eyelet 2.JPG


Here is a double-eyeleted or rather, a socketed rim. I have a better photo somewhere but can't find it now. But basically you're looking at a cut-through and can see how the socket flares out to pull on the internal cavity. Unfortunately you cannot see how it is crimped on the interior wall but at least you can see how spoke tension hangs from the exterior wall and pushes against the interior wall. You can also imagine the increased surface area.

Eyelet 3.JPG

Rims built like this have gone out of fashion for a few reasons:
1) Weight weenies have spoilt the party by demanding lighter products which are inferior. Sockets commit the crime of weighing a few grams.
2) Rim profile fashion. Sharp edges denote faster bicycles but sharp profiles don't allow engineers proper stress distribution - as seen in the OP's case.



Edit: here's the missing photo:

Eyelets 4.jpg


This eyelet is actually a two-part device. One is the large socket you can see there in gold. Look carefully and you'll see at the bottom if it, it is crimped onto the rim with a real eyelet just like in the first photo. These are erroneously called double-eyelet rims but are more accurately, socketed rims. The sockets have the added advantage of speeding up wheelbuilding since the nipple auto-positions itself in the cavity and never disappears inside the rim - the bane of the builder.
 
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Tim Hall

Guest
Location
Crawley
Thanks for that. I've got Ambrosio Evolution on at least one bike, which the manufacturer's website suggest are double eyeleted, like this:
RIAMEVO_P1.jpg
 
Location
Pontefract
I had similar happen with RS10 and 11's though I did get 7,000 miles a piece out of them.

edit
I might add planet-x replaced them after about a years usage.
 
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OP
OP
D

DWM

Well-Known Member
Thanks for all the information.

I'll let you know what Wiggle say when I get a response.

Cheers

Dave
 
OP
OP
D

DWM

Well-Known Member
So, I've heard back from Wiggle and I'm not massively impressed.

I have to return the wheel so that they can send it to their supplier to 'inspect the product for any manufacturing defects and decide on an outcome.' They go on to say 'If the product is not considered to have a manufacturers defect we may only be able offer a repair service which may incur a fixing charge.'

I purchased these wheels at the end of January, fitted them in early April, and have covered around 1500 miles since.

I am not sure what I expected them to say (and I could well be being unreasonable), but this seems a lot of effort (and some uncertainty for me) on something that I believe is pretty clear cut. Am I being unreasonable?

Cheers

Dave
 

davidphilips

Phil Pip
Location
Onabike
So, I've heard back from Wiggle and I'm not massively impressed.

I have to return the wheel so that they can send it to their supplier to 'inspect the product for any manufacturing defects and decide on an outcome.' They go on to say 'If the product is not considered to have a manufacturers defect we may only be able offer a repair service which may incur a fixing charge.'

I purchased these wheels at the end of January, fitted them in early April, and have covered around 1500 miles since.

I am not sure what I expected them to say (and I could well be being unreasonable), but this seems a lot of effort (and some uncertainty for me) on something that I believe is pretty clear cut. Am I being unreasonable?

Cheers

Dave

no you are not being unreasonable , keep friendly and wait hopefully for a good outcome no use worrying about something you can not change.
 
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